Which is what most westerns do. At a certain point you can judge people for falling for bullshit.
Judging people for their susceptibility to propaganda is only useful to the extent it informs who can be brought to our side.
Exactly! If we’re judging people for practical purposes like this then great. If we’re judging people as big idiots just for the purposes of sniffing our own farts, leave me out.
Counterpoint: I enjoying shitting on stupid people. I live in hellworld and will take whatever fun digs I can get.
I enjoying shitting on stupid people.
Ah, so you’re just an asshole.
Yes?
Do you know what site you’re on? We’re fucking assholes all the time. We literally have are own lingo and custom emojis for mocking people.
Burgerbrain
Westoid, kkkracker 
I’m not an asshole.
You sure about that? If I surveyed everyone you knew?
No.
This is indistinguishable from libs saying you have to be respectful to the chuds.
Yes.
And the conclusion for the western left is “hardly anyone”. Can’t form a proletariat party with bourgeois proletarians.
This is just defeatist.
It’s realist. These are the material conditions we live in.
Keep organizing where you can but the US is never going to have a socialist movement, not in its current state anyway. You can still do things to help people and try and push back a little against the imperialist war machine but you’ll never have the broad support of the USs labor aristocracy.
the US is never going to have a socialist movement
No realistic analysis can produce such an absolute conclusion. We’re in largely uncharted territory for a dozen reasons, and socialists have pulled off all sorts of unlikely victories before.
It’s realistic to note the many difficulties between us and our goal, but it’s defeatist to say “yeah have fun doing little things but you’re going to lose no matter what.”
Not to mention when the people got a sniff of a Social Democrat talking about class issues, his supporter base almost toppled a 30-year political dynasty in the Democratic Primary.
Imagine if actual revolutionaries could be heard and seen at the scale Bernie was.
Social Democrat talking about class issues, his supporter base almost toppled a 30-year political dynasty in the Democratic Primary.
Imagine if actual revolutionaries could be heard and seen at the scale Bernie was.
HAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHA!!!
Oh wait, you’re serious, let me laugh harder.
HAHAHAHAHA!!!
>Even where there is no prospect of achieving their election the workers must put up their own candidates to preserve their independence, to gauge their own strength and to bring their revolutionary position and party standpoint to public attention. They must not be led astray by the empty phrases of the democrats, who will maintain that the workers’ candidates will split the democratic party and offer the forces of reaction the chance of victory. All such talk means, in the final analysis, that the proletariat is to be swindled. The progress which the proletarian party will make by operating independently in this way is infinitely more important than the disadvantages resulting from the presence of a few reactionaries in the representative body. If the forces of democracy take decisive, terroristic action against the reaction from the very beginning, the reactionary influence in the election will already have been destroyed.
Karl Marx: Source
deleted by creator
breaking into the propaganda virology lab and licking all the Petri dishes
i’ll do what i want you aren’t my real dad
omg yes! like why is everyone reaction once theyve been duped is to get online and insist that no one do any self crit, and that there was NOTHING you could have done (ONE google search) to avoid falling for it. i say this as the most gullible person in the world. especially when the claims are truly unhinged
If you were above the age of 5 when 9/11 happened there’s no excuse. You saw very clearly how US propaganda works, and if you can’t recognize it by now that’s on you.
Seriously, I see the rise of people like
and other “leftists” who are mostly pro-US in terms of foreign policy, and it seems they’re mostly guys my age (late 20s early 30s) leading audiences of Zoomers, and it’s almost like they’re taking advantage of the fact they didn’t live through the post 9/11 war on terror buildup.Honestly I don’t give much credit to the youths either, I’m too young to remember 9/11, I just grew up in the aftermath and went “Oh this place is fucking insane”
But if you were there and watched it fucking happen, and you aren’t vehemently anti-US, get in the
It would seem that younger Americans are indeed less susceptible to propaganda
Maybe state propoganda but research shows they’re giving boomers a run for their money as far as falling for scams and bullshit online from non state departments.
There was a struggle session about this a while back but I 100% agree. Just like how we don’t excuse cops & troops for joining up because of all encompassing propaganda, we have to hold people accountable for their awful actions and opinions to some degree, even in the context of the western propaganda torment nexus.
There’s a pretty big difference between working as a cop or troop and passively consuming news. Living and doing something every day vs. stuff on a screen that you may not even be that interested in, and certainly have no influence over.
There’s a difference between passively consuming news and actively lapping up every gallon of slop they dump in front of you without even a moments pause.
Sure, and online you see much more of the latter. But most people aren’t reading every legacy media article the can find and doing weird NAFO twitter shit. Think of how many people have no interest in sports, or follow some sports only passively, and think of how you wouldn’t know that by hanging out in online spaces for fans to discuss sports all year.
Yes but people still live and exist in the real world. They can still see what’s going on around them. Someone else brought up 9/11 and that’s a great example, you didn’t have to be that tuned in to see the bullshit going on there. People should have learned their lesson from that, but they didn’t, they choose not to because even with things getting worse it’s still better to be in the imperial core and most Americans don’t want to question what’s keeping them in the core.
I don’t live in Ukraine or Israel. After 9/11 I didn’t go to Afghanistan or Iraq. All the bullshit I saw was through the media.
Most people care about (in rough order):
- Family, friends, the people close to them
- Their preferred recreation
- Work, school, and whatever non-recreation stuff they have to do to support themselves
- Stuff that they aren’t immediately interested in, but is close
- Stuff that they aren’t immediately interested in, but is farther away
- Stuff they actively dislike engaging with
The top three take up the vast majority of time and attention, and U.S. foreign policy is five or six for most people. It’s not a priority, which is exactly why those in charge can get away with so much bullshit.
I see this sentiment get spread around a lot but anecdotally idk if it’s all that true anymore, especially not with younger people. Everyone is more online these days, and I constantly hear coworkers and customers at my job chatting about shit I’m surprised they even know about. Some Zoomer cashier was discussing BRICS with a customer, and this is just a normie ass lower middle class punk. Also fyi his take on it’s was god awful. My boomer retire dad knows what NAFO is. Maybe it a byproduct of living in the DC metro area, but it does seem like I see more and more people dropping hot takes about countries they can’t find on a fucking map these days and most of them are brainwormed to fuck. Awful politics abound on tiktok and reddit and the normies seem to be engaging with it.
you really are underestimating how little people care about politics.
Someone would need to follow the news obsessively enough to notice inconsistencies in the narrative while most people are reading a headline once or twice a month
See my other comment.
It’s only propaganda if it comes from the Propagandeaux region of France, otherwise it’s just sparkling misinformation
“Damn, this conspiracy is a deep-cut.”
knew one guy who would actively seek out propaganda. He believed propaganda no one else had even heard of
