You’re changing the subject. While the OP is about christianity, this little subthread is about whether someone can lose their belief in atheism. Nobody in this subthread mentioned christianity until you did, and nobody in this subthread is a christian. I would appreciate some good faith engagement instead of changing the subject to those other guys over there we both hate. You hate em, I hate em, let’s get over it and actually have a fruitful discussion.
You’re saying you don’t believe in a system of atheism. I’m taking this to mean you don’t have any beliefs asserting your atheism. So if I accused you of not being an atheist, you wouldn’t deny it, right? Cause you don’t believe anything about you being an atheist. There are no beliefs you possess for me to challenge if I call you a theist, correct? You’d go along with it or hold a neutral view?
Atheism, by definition, is an absence of belief in deities. If you “accused” an atheist of “not being an atheist,” they would think you were confused about what atheism is. They would likely not be personally offended by your ignorance.
I don’t know why anyone would “go along with it” were you to incorrectly assert they held beliefs which they did not, but if they did, it would likely be in pity for or exasperation with the person impotently trying to “gotcha” their “beliefs.”
So, you’re playing a trick here. You’re saying you don’t have any beliefs, but you’re also saying you think I’m wrong. That’s not an absence of belief. That’s a negative belief. Belief in the absence of something, not absence of beliefs. You’re mixing the two up.
Here, I’ll explain with a hypothetical. Imagine you’re on a space ship with someone who doesn’t believe in vacuums. They think there’s air everywhere. They say the air in the ship is stuffy, and they want to open the window to get some fresh air in. You tell them that you’re all going to die if you do that, because there’s no air. It’s not that you have no beliefs, it’s that you specifically believe there is no air. It’s a belief in absence, not an absence of belief. Your belief in there being no air informs all sorts of other beliefs, like the belief that opening the window will kill you.
Do you have a belief in the absence of theism regarding yourself, or do you have an absence of belief regarding your religious status? You can only pick one, they’re mutually exclusive. You cannot have both.
Unfortunately for your ego, you have nothing relevant or novel to “explain” to me; you did not arrive at this discussion with an adequate understanding of “belief” or “atheism.”
And to your further misfortune, you haven’t developed the necessary reverence for growth which typically fosters the humility to recognize one’s own ignorance and error.
But the most salient bad luck you’ve wrought here has been the pain and loss of those who have chosen to read and engage with your blithering comments made in bad faith.
While you accuse me of not following the logic of your argument, you didn’t follow mine. I never said I was an atheist, you just assumed it. Actually, I’m agnostic. The reality is I don’t give a shit if you think I’m an atheist or not. Calling an atheist a theist is inaccurate, so is calling me one, but it doesn’t personally offend me, it’s just an inaccurate statement because it assigns a belief that I don’t hold.
Maybe respond in good faith if you want good faith back
You’re changing the subject. While the OP is about christianity, this little subthread is about whether someone can lose their belief in atheism. Nobody in this subthread mentioned christianity until you did, and nobody in this subthread is a christian. I would appreciate some good faith engagement instead of changing the subject to those other guys over there we both hate. You hate em, I hate em, let’s get over it and actually have a fruitful discussion.
You’re saying you don’t believe in a system of atheism. I’m taking this to mean you don’t have any beliefs asserting your atheism. So if I accused you of not being an atheist, you wouldn’t deny it, right? Cause you don’t believe anything about you being an atheist. There are no beliefs you possess for me to challenge if I call you a theist, correct? You’d go along with it or hold a neutral view?
God damn, Lemmy’s got some dumb fuckin’ users.
Atheism, by definition, is an absence of belief in deities. If you “accused” an atheist of “not being an atheist,” they would think you were confused about what atheism is. They would likely not be personally offended by your ignorance.
I don’t know why anyone would “go along with it” were you to incorrectly assert they held beliefs which they did not, but if they did, it would likely be in pity for or exasperation with the person impotently trying to “gotcha” their “beliefs.”
So, you’re playing a trick here. You’re saying you don’t have any beliefs, but you’re also saying you think I’m wrong. That’s not an absence of belief. That’s a negative belief. Belief in the absence of something, not absence of beliefs. You’re mixing the two up.
Here, I’ll explain with a hypothetical. Imagine you’re on a space ship with someone who doesn’t believe in vacuums. They think there’s air everywhere. They say the air in the ship is stuffy, and they want to open the window to get some fresh air in. You tell them that you’re all going to die if you do that, because there’s no air. It’s not that you have no beliefs, it’s that you specifically believe there is no air. It’s a belief in absence, not an absence of belief. Your belief in there being no air informs all sorts of other beliefs, like the belief that opening the window will kill you.
Do you have a belief in the absence of theism regarding yourself, or do you have an absence of belief regarding your religious status? You can only pick one, they’re mutually exclusive. You cannot have both.
Unfortunately for your ego, you have nothing relevant or novel to “explain” to me; you did not arrive at this discussion with an adequate understanding of “belief” or “atheism.”
And to your further misfortune, you haven’t developed the necessary reverence for growth which typically fosters the humility to recognize one’s own ignorance and error.
But the most salient bad luck you’ve wrought here has been the pain and loss of those who have chosen to read and engage with your blithering comments made in bad faith.
My ego? I don’t have much of an ego, I’m just a regular drone. If you think I’m important though thanks
They believe the absence of theism; the deity or religion is not relevant. It’s really that simple.
While you accuse me of not following the logic of your argument, you didn’t follow mine. I never said I was an atheist, you just assumed it. Actually, I’m agnostic. The reality is I don’t give a shit if you think I’m an atheist or not. Calling an atheist a theist is inaccurate, so is calling me one, but it doesn’t personally offend me, it’s just an inaccurate statement because it assigns a belief that I don’t hold.
Maybe respond in good faith if you want good faith back