Veganism is an opinion or philosophy, it does not come from any doctrinal teachings with historical writings to count as a belief system on the same level as someone who can only eat certified kosher food.
Being vegan is recent fad or trendy thing from the perspective of world history. Nutritionally, veganism is not healthy without an extensive amount of supplements. Before corporations could manufacture suppliments, everybody needed to eat a few animal products for basic health. In there West though, there is definitely way too much consumption of meat but pescatarian is very healthy.
B12 is not an “extensive amount of supplements”. Furthermore your average contemporary nonvegan likely consumes way more supplements than a vegan just indirectly through livestock feed, including B12. Even ignoring the “animal” sources though, people these days consume a lot of supplements from cereals, energy drinks, table salt, and more. I’m not sure why relying on supplements would even be a gotcha in the first place though.
Furthermore I’m not sure why it would matter that there exist healthy diets that include meat, like you said a mostly plant foods diet but including some fish. If anything that reinforces that there are other reasons for people abstaining entirely from animal foods. Veganism is way more than a diet, it is an ethical stance, and extends to far more than what we eat. It just so happens that what we eat leads to some of the most egregious abuses and also butts heads with culture because what we eat and what others eat is so important to us as humans. That’s why the way vegans choose to eat gets so much attention.
Being vegan is recent fad or trendy thing from the perspective of world history.
Abstaining from animal products has been a thing for at least a couple centuries (see al-Ma’arri)
Nutritionally, veganism is not healthy without an extensive amount of supplements.
The only supplement you must absolutely take on a vegan diet is vitamin B12. The source of vitamin B12 in omnivore diets is also supplements, albeit given to the animals raised for slaughter rather than taken directly. Supplementing omega-3 is also highly recommended for vegans. The other ones you’ll hear mentioned are vitamin D3 and iodine, with both of which many foods are fortified since most people, including those who eat an omnivorous diet, don’t get enough of these through their food. This is hardly what I’d call “an extensive amount of supplements”. I’ve been vegan for 7 years and the only supplements I take are B12, as well as vitamin D during the winter months since I live in a northern area.
Veganism is an opinion or philosophy, it does not come from any doctrinal teachings with historical writings to count as a belief system on the same level as someone who can only eat certified kosher food.
I agree, a person’s carefully thought-out ethical decisions about what they consume are different from someone doing something because an old book tells them to.
The only supplement you must absolutely take on a vegan diet is vitamin B12.
you’re not a nutritionist. ok, i’m assuming that. but i know you’re not my nutritionist and it’s highly unlikely you’re a nutritionist for anyone here. please do not tell people what their dietary needs are.
You’re completely right, I am not a nutritionist, and honestly I’d truly hope no one takes their nutrition advice from strangers on Lemmy. Next time I’ll add a disclaimer though, that’s a fair enough point.
That being said, I’ve been vegan for over 7 years, supplementing only B12 (and D during the winter) and I’m not dead yet.
It doesn’t only come from supplements, but it’s how most people get it these days. Livestock aren’t sticking their faces in wild dirt and flora very much, so most need supplements. Also even with livestock being given supplements there is a surprising amount of B12 deficiency in the omnivore population, arguably more should be supplementing.
We ate a lot more meat. The modern American diet pyramid puts plant matter at the base, while historically meat was at the base. The longest living and healthiest populations today eat a lot of meat, up to 99% of their diet.
What do you mean by this? Do you mean like the people living in the so called Blue Zones?
Eat mostly plants, especially beans. And eat meat rarely, in small portions of 3 to 4 ounces. Blue Zoners eat portions this size just five times a month, on average.
Gotta love that vegan propaganda! Have you ever seen Ikaria? They don’t grow shit there as the island is just one big mountain. Their main food is sea food and dairy. And stop with Okinawa already! It has been debunked by Okinawans themselves - their main food is pork. Okinawa is the biggest consumer of pork in the whole of Japan.
Veganism is an opinion or philosophy, it does not come from any doctrinal teachings with historical writings to count as a belief system on the same level as someone who can only eat certified kosher food.
Being vegan is recent fad or trendy thing from the perspective of world history. Nutritionally, veganism is not healthy without an extensive amount of supplements. Before corporations could manufacture suppliments, everybody needed to eat a few animal products for basic health. In there West though, there is definitely way too much consumption of meat but pescatarian is very healthy.
This tells everything about your knowledge about the subject.
it’s correct so i don’t know what your comment means.
There is long history of veganism and you chose to ignore it.
no, there isn’t. it’s a term coined in the 1940s in colonialist Britain.
Gosh I wonder where they got the idea to name this phenomenon
There’s no history of veganism anywhere in the world.
B12 is not an “extensive amount of supplements”. Furthermore your average contemporary nonvegan likely consumes way more supplements than a vegan just indirectly through livestock feed, including B12. Even ignoring the “animal” sources though, people these days consume a lot of supplements from cereals, energy drinks, table salt, and more. I’m not sure why relying on supplements would even be a gotcha in the first place though.
Furthermore I’m not sure why it would matter that there exist healthy diets that include meat, like you said a mostly plant foods diet but including some fish. If anything that reinforces that there are other reasons for people abstaining entirely from animal foods. Veganism is way more than a diet, it is an ethical stance, and extends to far more than what we eat. It just so happens that what we eat leads to some of the most egregious abuses and also butts heads with culture because what we eat and what others eat is so important to us as humans. That’s why the way vegans choose to eat gets so much attention.
Livestock feed is just grass. Just like 1,000 years ago.
Even so called “grass fed” cows aren’t 100% grass fed.
Of course they are. Why would a farmer pay for food when the grass is free? Unless they’re Americans…
Abstaining from animal products has been a thing for at least a couple centuries (see al-Ma’arri)
The only supplement you must absolutely take on a vegan diet is vitamin B12. The source of vitamin B12 in omnivore diets is also supplements, albeit given to the animals raised for slaughter rather than taken directly. Supplementing omega-3 is also highly recommended for vegans. The other ones you’ll hear mentioned are vitamin D3 and iodine, with both of which many foods are fortified since most people, including those who eat an omnivorous diet, don’t get enough of these through their food. This is hardly what I’d call “an extensive amount of supplements”. I’ve been vegan for 7 years and the only supplements I take are B12, as well as vitamin D during the winter months since I live in a northern area.
I agree, a person’s carefully thought-out ethical decisions about what they consume are different from someone doing something because an old book tells them to.
you’re not a nutritionist. ok, i’m assuming that. but i know you’re not my nutritionist and it’s highly unlikely you’re a nutritionist for anyone here. please do not tell people what their dietary needs are.
You’re completely right, I am not a nutritionist, and honestly I’d truly hope no one takes their nutrition advice from strangers on Lemmy. Next time I’ll add a disclaimer though, that’s a fair enough point.
That being said, I’ve been vegan for over 7 years, supplementing only B12 (and D during the winter) and I’m not dead yet.
So if B12 is only available by supplements one way or another. How did we survive before supplements?
Looking it up ruminants produce it naturally so wouldn’t say we get it cause cows are getting shots.
It doesn’t only come from supplements, but it’s how most people get it these days. Livestock aren’t sticking their faces in wild dirt and flora very much, so most need supplements. Also even with livestock being given supplements there is a surprising amount of B12 deficiency in the omnivore population, arguably more should be supplementing.
We ate a lot more meat. The modern American diet pyramid puts plant matter at the base, while historically meat was at the base. The longest living and healthiest populations today eat a lot of meat, up to 99% of their diet.
What do you mean by this? Do you mean like the people living in the so called Blue Zones?
Gotta love that vegan propaganda! Have you ever seen Ikaria? They don’t grow shit there as the island is just one big mountain. Their main food is sea food and dairy. And stop with Okinawa already! It has been debunked by Okinawans themselves - their main food is pork. Okinawa is the biggest consumer of pork in the whole of Japan.
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