• NaibofTabr@infosec.pub
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      11 months ago

      What? No it isn’t.

      No part of the article discusses replacing the logistics function of cargo vehicles, but it does propose ripping out the road infrastructure they run on.

      • grue@lemmy.world
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        11 months ago

        Apparently, you are unaware that cargo bikes are a thing.

        • NaibofTabr@infosec.pub
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          11 months ago

          Right… and how many such bikes would you need to replace the carrying capacity of a single 18-wheeler?

          This is not a practical solution.

          Also, not discussed in the article and not relevant to my previous comment.

          • abessman@lemmy.world
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            11 months ago

            18 wheelers are not last mile delivery vehicles and have no business being in cities to begin with.

            • NaibofTabr@infosec.pub
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              11 months ago

              Um, yes they are? 18 wheelers deliver goods to stores all the time. How are you even trying to make this argument? What kind of vehicle do you think usually pulls up to a loading dock?

              • abessman@lemmy.world
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                11 months ago

                What kind of vehicle do you think usually pulls up to a loading dock?

                Grocery stores inside cities do not have loading docks. Their goods are typically delivered by this type of vehicle to curb-side offloading sites during off-peak hours.

                • NaibofTabr@infosec.pub
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                  11 months ago

                  148 E 17th St https://maps.app.goo.gl/a3wp7u1spEN4Vtjm7

                  Here’s a grocery store. It’s in downtown Little Rock (pop 204k).

                  Bet you anything you like all that cardboard got hauled away in an 18 wheeler (or a recycling truck).

                  To be clear (and reitierate) I’m not talking about heavily urbanized places, I’m talking about moderately urbanized places (which there are a lot more of). Converting a few inner city blocks in super dense cities is entirely meaningless in terms of helping the environment. For a solution/change to be useful, it will need to have wider applicability (to the majority of cities, which have <1m pop).

                  • abessman@lemmy.world
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                    11 months ago

                    I’m talking about moderately urbanized places (which there are a lot more of).

                    Such places exist as a direct consequence of car culture. Their existence is not a universal constant; they can and must be turned into heavily urbanized areas.

              • bdonvr@thelemmy.club
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                11 months ago

                Most urbanists also despise mega-mart style stores as well, and would rather have smaller stores littered throughout neighborhoods

                • zeluko@kbin.social
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                  11 months ago

                  Reduces the dependence on cars as the stores nearby have what you need without having to drive super far and to buy so much because its so far.

              • inasaba@lemmy.ml
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                11 months ago

                They deliver goods to big box stores, not to the kinds of stores one finds in a dense, walkable downtown core area. I have worked in the delivery industry, and we served the downtown core entirely with 5-ton and 3-ton trucks and cargo vans. It’s simply not practical to get a full-sized trailer in there.

    • LemmyIsFantastic@lemmy.world
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      11 months ago

      Oh, this lie?

      Nearly a quarter (23 per cent) of car journeys were under two miles and 60 per cent under five miles. “You could really walk two miles. By the time you get in the car, parked it, you have arrived there in the same time,” said Dr Fuller.

      Yeah that’s totally going to get people to charge their behavior and not piss them off.

      • simpleTailor@startrek.website
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        11 months ago

        By the time you get in the car, parked it, you have arrived there in the same time,” said Dr Fuller.

        This lie?

        Speaking solely for myself here: I used to have a mental block that prevented me from calculating travel time by different modes equitably. If it was a 10 minute drive, or a 20 minute walk, my calculation was anchored to the 10-minute drive as the “real” amount of time, and so the 20 minute walk always felt like a waste of 10 minutes. I think it’s easy to fall into this trap, especially when our lives are busy and we’re trying to save time anywhere we can. But a 20 minute walk is 20 minutes less I have to go to the gym, and 10 minutes less that I have to be hyper alert and driving a 2T vehicle around other people.

        Additionally, this mental block existed for me around time spent parking and walking from my car to my destination. Obviously I had to walk from my car, so my brain saw that as +0 minutes. But when I calculated it, I found that I was often spending meaningful amounts of time on this leg:

        My urban office is 6 miles from my suburban home (metro area approx 2.5MM people). Even with a highway for half the trip (which gets clogged with commuter and freight traffic during rush hours) the drive is approximately 20-25 minutes during light traffic, or as long as 40 minutes if traffic is particularly heavy. I have to park in a garage, which involves circling for a spot, and then have a 15 min walk to my office. On a good day, 35 minutes. On a bad day, almost an hour.

        But taking my ebike (which I only bought because of the many steep hills between me and work) through back roads and sidestreets, it’s 35-40 minutes door to door. Now I get 35-40 minutes of exercise without having to go to the gym, and my vehicle is parked right at thr exit to my building. Plus, I can charge the ebike with company electricity instead of having to pay for gas for my car.

        Yeah that’s totally going to get people to charge their behavior and not piss them off

        It pisses a lot of people off when they can’t park right next to their destination. But that already happens. There is a limited amount of space at places people want to be, so someone will always have to park farther away. Circling the nearby streets for parking is also annoying as fuck, and a huge waste of time.