I don’t think Threads need the fediverse to survive or thrive.
And correct me if I’m wrong but I think Mastodon’s biggest instances don’t mind federating with Threads.
Why on earth would they be interested in federating with meta??
A lot of them are taking a “let’s give them a chance” stance which is fucked because we have over a decade of social media history as to why they’ve already spent that chance and cannot be trusted. There’s also the fact of Meta meeting with Mastodon instance admins and having them sign NDAs if they agree to talk.
I won’t be on an instance that federates with them, personally.
There is more then a century of proven ‘companies lie for profit and will do anything upto and including global genocide to increase their bottom dollar’
Never trust a company when they provide their goals.
This just keeps getting worse and worse.
Is there any mention of which instances have committed to NOT federating with Meta?
I think fediverse servers should adopt a set of sustainable limits for themselves, one of which should be: do not maintain more than X active users. If they have over that amount, they should shut down signups. If they don’t shut down signups, everyone else should defederate them until they cooperate.
This is a really good idea. Maybe someone can make a site called “Too powerful” that lists the bloated instances or something.
However: I’m not super deep into lemmy architecture, but what would stop the instance ops from creating a “sister instance” the the same rules and owners?
I think that should be considered willful subversion of the fediverse “tenates” which wouldn’t be condoned. Sure, people could always do it in secret, but if they were ever exposed it would be grounds for defederation.
Designing said tenates would take lots of open discussion from the community, but I do think it is important if we’re going to maintain a working fediverse. Corporations like Google and msft have embraced/extended/extinguished open platforms in the past, and it looks like meta is trying the same thing again. If we say “the platform is open, everything is allowed, anyone is welcome, the fediverse will sort itself out” then it will inevitably be dismantled by organized attacks on the platform.
The fediverse is both the technical architecture, and the decentralized culture of the people using it.
Hopefully we’ve collectively seen EEE enough to guard against it this time
I hope so too, but…I wouldn’t count on it. It’s really interesting thinking about the nature of the internet/fediverse as it relates to human civilization. It’s apparent why holy texts and totalitarian monarchies were beneficial for past societies to whip people into line and make things work. The fediverse doesn’t have a central govt, it feels more libertarian right now. I think we need a fediverse version of “the federalist papers” to define how instances should cooperate to sustain itself.
The reality is, the internet was already federated. From the birth of the WWW everyone was able to make their own website and connect to a decentralized network. And look at what happened: corporations took over, everything became centralized, and users became the products.
If we sit idly by and think the fediverse will always sustain itself, I’m convinced the day will come when it won’t.
What instance hasn’t defederated from threads honestly
Fucking Mastodon
Fosstodon had the balls to not sell out
Also Meta has not federated yet but said they will in the future so any “defederation” from instances is just a declaration of future plans since there is nothing to cut off yet
My instance hasn’t defederated from anywhere. This is exactly why I chose vlemmy
exploding-heads even? Yikes
I don’t know what they did but I want to be in control of what I get to see. Unless it’s anything illegal I’d rather not let someone else choose for me
You’re delusional.
The fediverse stuff is just a bullet point on a sales sheet, Facebook doesn’t give a shit about federating with Lemmy or Mastodon or whatever.
The reason they don’t give a shit is they already have a user base that is multiple times larger than Lemmy and Mastodon combined. Also normal people don’t even know what those things are. My mom doesn’t know what Mastodon is, she does know what Twitter and threads is.
Here’s the thing though:
If we don’t defederate, the users can subscribe to our communities and get involved and make them stronger as they become the official go to places. We can always crush it later if it becomes a hassle.
If we defederate immediately, the users will make their own communities which will quickly leave ours in the dirt as the larger ones of the Fediverse.
Just a thought.
I wouldn’t share a tear for Meta’s new plaything, they’re gonna have more users on Threads on the first day than the entire Fediverse combined. Apparently they’re not even linking up yet, it’s still on their to-do list?
It’s a bit disconnected that anybody thinks meta is at all worried.
If anything, anybody wanting to get their instances in front of tons of eyeballs is going to be scrambling to federate (in an attempt to court away meta users)
Oh man, this is genuinely depressing. I just checked it out for the first time and almost every thread I see is “omg this is so much better than twitter” “Guess we’re all on threads now?” and just complete lack of awareness of the fediverse at all, and I’m just sitting here like “the fediverse has been better than twitter…and facebook…and instagram… and reddit… for a long time now…” but everyone is just gonna throw flowers at Facebook for making a hackneyed handicapped version of it and there’s nothing we can do.
This time next year everywhere you see little social media buttons and links the threads symbol will be there by default and people will still have no idea about Lemmy or Mastadon. I’m gonna try really hard to focus on how much of a good thing that is because of its lessening of the horrors of Eternal September in these spaces.
What instance hasn’t defederated from threads honestly
Threads does not really want or care about our tiny userbase. They want the normies and they want to OWN most of the marketshare of this protocol
What’s with all the hate about federating with Threads? I thought people would be happy to hear a big player is coming to the fediverse that’s going to bring a bunch of people with it. “Normies” will probably never use Mastodon or Lemmy but might use Threads, so being able to communicate with them while staying on my little community-ran Mastodon instance is a win for the fediverse in my book. And if somebody’s annoying or whatever, you can always block them, right? Can somebody clarify why people think everyone should automatically defederate with them and lose such a big userbase? I mean, I hate Facebook/Meta as much as the next guy, but more users are more users…
Threads owned by Zuck, which has both a “for-profit” and “unethical” mindset. In my opinion this mindset isn’t fit for the fediverse in the place where it is now (people actually care about the community). Users will always come, we don’t need papa Zuck for that. Healthy communities grow naturally, and I feel like the fediverse community is healthy enough.
Its that many people are convinced that Meta will EEE (Embrace, Extend, Extinguish). However we can’t just all defederate Meta from the Fediverse. We have to embrace them the same way they are embracing us. If they decide to try to kill us off, we will resist and stay united.
Somebody posted an article here a few days ago about the ways big corporations kill Open source software. The broad overview was essentially that they’ll adopt the standard, then expand on it to create a more feature rich walled garden. Then they axe the connections to the original protocols when they have critical mass, and begin the enshittification process. If meta is allowed to succeed in the Fediverse, it’s the first step to meta owning any worthwhile platforms in the Fediverse.
Nobody should want any corporate social platforms in the fediverse they spy on you sell your data to the highest bidder and ultimately all are basically like the corner drug dealer
All your fediverse data is public, they don’t need to join the fediverse or “spy” on you to get it
If I wanted to hear what people who use FB products had to say, I’d be on those platforms
Nobody said anything about FB users. I have seen a bunch of people I follow on Twitter trying to move to Threads. And if I could just completely abandon Twitter and communicate with these people I follow via Mastodon, I’d rather choose for them to move there instead. And nobody’s making you talk to them if you don’t want to, right? We are talking about ~being able~ to talk to them, not having to.
And I didn’t say anything about talking to them
I’m sure there’s no profit motive for Meta to confederate.
Meta is a “for profit” company, so every move they make is for profit and planned with their shareholders/board of directors, to approve their moves. These people only see $$$, sad but true.
They do have a profit motive, because meta is in competition with lemmy for people’s time and attention. The more attention/time/views meta gets, the better for them. So it is in their interest to find a way to create their own instance, make it the most popular one, and then use that popularity to shut out all other instances, effectively killing them.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Embrace,_extend,_and_extinguish
So only people without profit motive can beat part of it… Change is scary I guess
Won’t someone think of the corporate investors that need to make money on my memes?
Allowing people and corporations with poor to no ethics considerations whose sole motive is profit to control everything isn’t change, it’s the default that the Fediverse is trying to get away from.
What’s with all the hate about federating with Threads? I thought people would be happy to hear a big player is coming to the fediverse that’s going to bring a bunch of people with it.
It’s because corporations will embrace, extend, and extinguish.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Embrace,_extend,_and_extinguish
Allowing corporations to have any level of control will result in this place dying.
It doesn’t even have to be extinguishing. It’s bad enough if meta can reap the benefits of associating with FOSS (better privacy for example), while making their app the gateway to the fediverse. And of course that app will be spyware with social media on top. It’s like greenwashing.
I wish all instances did. Sadly some have a growth mindset bigger than their own ego and don’t mind the Zuck’
Until they are killed by the zuck
Or until their quality users will leave
Yes please defederate this shit and leave us alone
Defederate from, and anybody who federates with Meta. Fuck Meta/Zuck, they are enshittification incarnate.
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Tbh I’m seeing a lot of Mastodon instances Admins saying they wont defederate Threads straight away; they want to see what Meta does/demands of all over instances first. The instance I’m part of (Fosstodon) is also doing the “wait and see” tactic.
BUT I strongly suspect most will end up defederating with Threads within a week due to Meta’s shit moderation and attempts to bully other, larger instances into giving them privacy info.
Wtf. What possible good thing do they expect to see from meta?
People. Most of the people using Threads are not garbage just because Meta is.
I’ll likely be personally blocking the entire instance the day they connect with ActivityPub.
I mean Threads isn’t even starting in the EU yet, bc they can’t comply with the GDPR. Nothing good can come of this.
most of the people are not garbage
Guess what? Neither are most people on FB and Twitter, but it’s allowing the garbage minority to have free reign that make those platforms unbearable.
I can guarantee that the same will happen with Threads sooner or later since it’s the same corporation with the same company-wide priorities that allowed FB to become a breeding ground for fascism.
Facebook was ruined for me when they stopped showing me what my friends were up to, and instead plastered my feed with ads and “popular” posts instead of the things I care about. I haven’t logged in for years. I should delete Facebook, but since it isn’t on any of my devices they aren’t getting anything from me
Ehhhhhhhh yeah they can stay over there. Totally free to join us here though, separately, on another account. They are the dark side, with the cookies and all. We have beans. Better nutrition.
Damn… I did not know Threads was going to be part of the fediverse. I only just found this unspoiled corner of the internet, I’d like it to stay as is please!
Wasn’t there just a post about how all instance admins can access user action logs from all instances?
Would this potentially allow meta to grab info on users based on their upvote/downvotes? I’m pretty sure my email is linked to my account here, and it’s not a far jump to link it to any other accounts I use it for to build a profile depending on the data available.
Meta might already be secretly running any number of existing instances. For that matter, someone else you don’t trust definitely already is.
I guess that’s the ultimate trade off with social media. There is no expectation of privacy and no way to avoid the corporations looking to influence you to make a buck.
I love that we have options but I hate the direction the internet as a whole is going. It makes me sad when I think too much about it.
idk why they are logging and how much amount of information they are logging but atleast they aren’t selling that to the third parties or using that for personalized advertisements.
That’s the thing, we don’t know that. We have to go on their word and look how that has turned out in the past.
Reddit said no API changes and then they change the API, Facebook said they secure our data, and then the Cambridge analytics scandal came to light, Equifax told us that they could be trusted with our most personal credit information and they had a huge data breach.
The fediverse is going to be new to a lot of people, such as myself, who don’t yet fully understand the ins and outs of how it works. It’s my understanding that it’s open source, but I unfortunately don’t have the competencies to review code and see where every piece of data is going and what is actually logged. I have heard of some websites being transparent with the data that’s logged, but there’s no guarantee that they’re telling the whole story.
All that being said, I’m always happy when there’s a decentralized version of a service that people can use as an alternative.
It’s my understanding that it’s open source, but I unfortunately don’t have the competencies to review code and see where every piece of data is going and what is actually logged.
I am a beginner software engineer and I kinda have no clue about many parts of the source code too, but one thing I could notice is that there are lot’s of people that are actively contributing to the source code. I hope if lemmy tries something funny, the open source contributers would be the first people to call it out.
