And opposing those actions is not antisemitic.
We take those two things together as truth and we are getting somewhere.
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demands for Israels destruction and the ouster and/or murder of All of it’s Jews
From the River To the Sea, and Hamas banners, and the Jews are the New Nazis
These are not the same thing.
I wish the mods would stop removing comments and instead refute them.
Would be more helpful and productive.
Tbf “from the river to the sea” and “Israel destruction” are pretty much the same thing.
You realize that this proclamation was first made by the Zionists who meant the genocide of Palestinians with it? This is strongly opposed from the Palestinians who demand freedom and rights from the River to the Sea and rightfully so.
A state with equals rights on th former Mandatory Palestine territory would free “from the river to the see”. If you think that it’s imply the destruction of the state of Israel, it’s mean that for you, the very existence of the Israel State couldn’t lead to the freedom of people on that territory.
If this only thing that matter is freedom, this exactly what is shout out.
If you thing this dog whistle, give sources. The only one I found was zionist organizations. In a time of war, I’m not sure we could rely on its.
Couldn’t let it be could you?
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Cretins? Not sure that’s a word you want to use, pal, it’s a pretty bad slur.
Seems like some very motivated reasoning, there
I really wish this didn’t need to be clarified every few days. Thanks, zionists and white supremacists!
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I only hate the zionists and a great many of them are not Jewish.
Many of them are open antisemites even. Zionism and Antisemitism are allied ideologies.
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It is counterintuitive but it does make sense. You see the initial plan the Nazis used to try to get rid of the Jews was to expel them from Germany. They had no problem if the Jews all grouped together and settled their own country so long as it was somewhere else. Far away from them. (And when they didn’t leave they made conditions horrible for them). That’s why antisemites love Zionism; it’s a way to get rid of the Jewish population in their country without dirtying their hands with ethnic cleansing. Which is how we get to conspiracy nutjobs who rant about Jewish space lasers setting forest fires in the US for some reason, turning around and enthusiastically supporting Israel and defence aid for Israel.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Zionist_antisemitism
To put it briefly. Zionism is a ethno-nationalist ideology. One country for each ethnicity and were the dominating ethnicity gets to supress every minority. This on the one hand is what whit supremacist fascists believe too. On the other hand Israels key claim to its right to exist at the genocide and ethnic cleansing of Palestinians is that Israel would be the only safe place for Jews in the world. If Jews are persecuted and discriminated against outside of Israel this is good for Israel as they can justify their existence with it. For Antisemites historically and today it is great to allow for an out to “get rid of the Jews” by sending them to Israel. Exactly what was done by Britain.
So they both share the same ideological core, which is ethnostates (“Blut und Boden” - blood and soil, like the Nazis called it) and operatively they profit from each other.
The current right wing government also doesn’t represent every citizen of Israel either, but it is ok to use ‘Israel’ as a shorthand for the actions of the current right wing government when the actions are a continuation of decades of similar colonialism and the government is in power due to how the majority of the population voted.
So hatred against everyone in Israel is also wrong, but saying Israel is committing genocide doesn’t require saying it is the current government.
This meme should say “The actions of Israel does not represent the will of all Jews,”
Edit: I expect everyone who down voted also refrains from using Russia, China, or the United States and other names of countries when making criticisms for consistency. “Russia didn’t invade Ukraine, the current Putin led government did.”
This is why I try to specify that my complaints are about Netanyahu or the IDF.
And the Zionists.
I’m a little fuzzy on exactly what Zionism is, so I just don’t talk about it, rather than saying something accidentally racist, and/or making an ass of myself.
Someone correct me if im wrong, but Zionism is Isreali radical nationalism, their primary goal is the creation of a Jewish ethno-state in current isreal and palestine.
The Youtuber Shaun has a great video going through the history of the conflict and Zionism: https://youtu.be/3xottY-7m3k
You are mostly there. One of the most important notes is that the project is settler colonial, and it is also helpful to point out that zionism is older than Israel, and it has been around for over 100 years.
+1 on that Shaun vid, it’s great
Yea sorry, the creation of an ethno-state in palestine through colonialism. I did not know that its older than isreal though, good to know.
And shauns vids are top tier lol.
Any kind of Israeli nationalism can be zionism, doesn’t need to be radical.
I like this approach. I wish more people would be honest about the limits of their arguments instead of just saying whatever they think will help them ‘win’.
Thank you. It’s the result of hard earned experience!
Zionism is basically the belief that Jewish people deserve to own Palestine/Jerusalem (“Zion”) and that non-Jews should be ethnically cleansed from “Zion” (the Nakba)
The second part of your definition definitely isnt true for all forms of Zionism. Zionism is as broad of a political ideology as liberalism, conservativism or communism is. Some zionists will agree with that, some won’t or “soften” it to “we’ll let them stay as second class citizens lol”
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Yeah no. Jewish Israeli people can live in Palestine, with the Arabs they’re trying to displace, like Jews have for thousands of years before modern Israel existed. Israel is inherently, and has always been, an apartheid ethnostate and has no reason nor right to exist. Israeli nationalism is a bad thing and Israel’s entire purpose is Jewish supremacy. If you remove the “ethnostate” aspect of Israel, you don’t have Israel; there is no Israel without either apartheid or genocide of non-Jews.
Israel has no right to exist. No state really has any right to exist, but Israel’s existence is especially bad. It should be dissolved. That doesn’t mean displacement of the people that live there, that means the replacement of the Israeli state.
There are plenty of Israelis who were adults when Israel was founded, and participated in the extermination of Arabs during the colonial occupation, and cheered on the theft of their lands. They form the foundation of Israeli society, and most of the non-Arab Israeli populace still encourages the oppression and genocide of Arabs. I do not believe any individual who cheers on the genocide of the peoples their great-grandparents recently stole the lives of should have the “right” to live on the recently stolen land.
I don’t really use the term myself because I find it too vague. People shift what they mean when they use it so I stick to the actual concepts I’m discussing. The existence of a state for Jews and apartheid settler colonialism are morally polls apart.
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I clarify my complaints are about Israel, the state, not Jewish people who do not live in the country.
You cannot have Netanyahu or the IDF without Israel existing.
The jewish population in israel is in a better position to effect change than the loudest voices anywhere else
And most of them happily endorse the genocide and ethnic cleansing of Palestine. We need to oust the Israelis as the fascists they are and make it clear that they do no speak for Jews in general and their fascist ideology is in direct contradiction to the values of Judaism. I am most worried for and most impressed by the few Jews in Israel that fight this fascist regime and get attacked and in return by it, while the West proclaims to stand for the fight against antisemitism by supporting the abuse of Jews who stand up for Jewish values.
How can I tell decent Jewish organizations from those who actively support genocide?
Read what they and their representatives publish and post on official social media accounts.
Those who support the genocide in deed are almost never shy about doing so with words too.
Anyways, Jewish Voice For Peace are the gold standard in accurate naming and one of the best anti war crime organizations in the world, so that’s at least one right there 🙂
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Legitimately, the fact that they’re an American org will usually be a fair indicator.
The zionist movement fell flat on its face in the US during the foundation of Israel, so most pro-palestinian jewish activism will be based out of the US as well.
This dynamic has intensified enough since that initial split that Israeli Judaism has actually taken on fundamentally different qualities from American Judaism, to the point where some scholars would consider them separate denominational groups.
It’s also fostered enough bad blood that a frequent dismissal of Israelis when hearing of Jews who oppose the settlement project is to say “they must just be stupid Americans.”
They legit try to do the "they aren’t authentic!" bit other old worlders and Latine folks will whip out when putting down their American cousins for not being identical to them, except with the Israelis it’s even funnier because bitch you ain’t where you came from either, that was literally the whole point of this great displacement project y’all whipped up!
… Yep… And we repeat that sentiment for Hamas.
Yes, thank you!
The very belief that the decisions of the powerful few are a reflection of the opinions of the people as a whole is how we got ourselves into this mess in the first place…
I wish we could say the same about Israelis.
Not all Israelis support netanyahu or the death/colonisation. Even if maybe the majority do.
Too many do, unfortunately.
Same for Americans. There are some good ones in there.
Actually Canadians are from a completely different country
Thousands of copies need to be airdropped over Capitol Hill by helicopter.
on a sidenote how’s this format a meme, it’s just weird to me
Read from Israeli activists like Ilan Papé describe the Israeli society as a fascist supremacist society. they don’t care about the right of Palestinians to live freely on their land.
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Participating in the Israeli conquest and ethnic purge absolutely deserves hatred and disgust.
This goes well beyond the Israeli’s right most partisan faction and extends to the entire Zionist movement.
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you hold ethnic hatred and disgust for Jews
Is Zionism an ethnicity? Does that mean anti-Zionist Jews aren’t Jewish?
I honestly can’t reach any other conclusion
Reach harder
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OP said that hatred of Jews isn’t justified
Conflating anti-Zionism with anti-Semitism is a right wing Israel talking point.
I thought we established that we don’t like them
I wasn’t talking about all jews around the world of course not, but arguing that Jewish people living in Israel and other jews supporting Israel are just as equally as responsible as the state of Israel. you wouldn’t even hear a shred of concern towards the Palestinians beings bombed by their own people with their own money.
