So when I read this, don’t think:
“Let’s stop ID’ing people when they buy alcohol or weed” (someday), but instead I think:
“Why aren’t IDs free!?”
If it’s critical and a civil need to ID people for all sorts of valid reasons, then it should be free/tax funded.
I’d rather tax money cover something like IDs than hear agreements about trying to restrict fraud. If you want to prevent voter fraud, eliminate reasons that allow the conditions to persist.
Thanks for the read. I do t have an easy idea for the time. Indiana BMV was massively improved a while ago. Maybe we need more of that. There’s probably no getting around taking the time to establish identity or dealing with stupid documents. We have to start somewhere.
…or the government records your DNA at birth, then we’re good. - j/k, that would scare everyone into rage and riots 🙃
Even free IDs would take time and money away from the poor in terms of time off of work (if they can get it) and transportation costs. And then they still have to have some documentation to prove who they are, which they may not have. Replacing those documents take even more time effort and it isn’t free.
I was born in Monroe County. Google tells me replacing my birth certificate if I’ve lost it is $16. I don’t know what I need to do for that $16, because their website is broken.
Meanwhile, this is what you need to obtain an ID in Indiana:
Make no mistake, this is all about stopping people from voting.
I get it, but I disagree. I don’t it’s about voting, I think it affects voting.
I’d rather fix the poor problem than allow voter fraud.
The fees for everything we need government services for, like getting a document is outrageous. Why the he’ll do we pay taxes to fund government agencies local/state/etc and then still pay fees?
That’s double taxation. I think that’s the real fight on poor people. That document fee is over some people’s hourly wage, but yet it’s required.
That’s about like having to be in debt in order to build credit. It all serves to take money from working class to wealthy.
Can anyone prove definitely that corrupt politicians are trying to keep poor voters from voting?
Still seems like an assertion that’s a matter of opinion.
Did anyone throw the same fit about driving cars? You have to take the same time off work and get all the same documents to do literally every other civil function: legally drive to work, open a bank account for direct deposit, get a credit card, get medical treatment, get insurance, file taxes, etc. You have to pay for transportation to the grocery store if you don’t have a car.
Why is just one political group making a fuss about it, which seems to be really focus on voting? You only vote once in a while. You do or use those other examples every day.
I feel like a larger issue is just being exploited for political people to make victom statements.
Why is voting less important to prove identity than buying alcohol?
I’m not a citizen of this country. You’re saying I can/should vote? That’s illegal, but what stops me. I could do it a bunch of times too, I just go to different places.
Why is just one political group making a fuss about it, which seems to be really focus on voting?
Because Republicans don’t want the poor to be voting. Especially if those poor people aren’t white. Do you really find it shocking that Republicans do better if black people aren’t able to vote? Because that’s what Jim Crow was all about.
I’m not a citizen of this country. You’re saying I can/should vote?
No, that’s why you register to vote. You can’t vote with an ID if you haven’t registered. And for all of my life until this ID nonsense, they just checked your signature against the address you registered and you could vote.
If you tried to do some sort of fraudulent voting, you would have to somehow register to vote multiple times.
You know what you also couldn’t do? Register to vote multiple times, even if you didn’t have an ID, because you had to show something very simple like an official bill to your address and you could register.
Again- you find me evidence that there was massive voter fraud that ID stopped. The fact is, it didn’t stop any fraud, but it did stop a lot of poor black people from voting.
Again, read the League of Women voters link. Note that the very first headline is:
Voter Photo ID Laws Won’t Prevent Voter Fraud
The second is:
ID Laws as Voter Suppression
It will explain the whole thing even better than I can.
Although I’m sure you can find a reason to discount anything that the largest nonpartisan voting advocacy group in the nation, which has been around for more than a century, is full of shit. Let’s hear it.
I can understand dealing in all cash, but you can’t legally drive cars with a DL. Is that racist? This logically means requiring motorists to have ID is racist and discrimination right?
So when I read this, don’t think: “Let’s stop ID’ing people when they buy alcohol or weed” (someday), but instead I think: “Why aren’t IDs free!?”
If it’s critical and a civil need to ID people for all sorts of valid reasons, then it should be free/tax funded.
I’d rather tax money cover something like IDs than hear agreements about trying to restrict fraud. If you want to prevent voter fraud, eliminate reasons that allow the conditions to persist.
Thanks for the read. I do t have an easy idea for the time. Indiana BMV was massively improved a while ago. Maybe we need more of that. There’s probably no getting around taking the time to establish identity or dealing with stupid documents. We have to start somewhere.
…or the government records your DNA at birth, then we’re good. - j/k, that would scare everyone into rage and riots 🙃
Even free IDs would take time and money away from the poor in terms of time off of work (if they can get it) and transportation costs. And then they still have to have some documentation to prove who they are, which they may not have. Replacing those documents take even more time effort and it isn’t free.
I was born in Monroe County. Google tells me replacing my birth certificate if I’ve lost it is $16. I don’t know what I need to do for that $16, because their website is broken.
Meanwhile, this is what you need to obtain an ID in Indiana:
Make no mistake, this is all about stopping people from voting.
I get it, but I disagree. I don’t it’s about voting, I think it affects voting.
I’d rather fix the poor problem than allow voter fraud.
The fees for everything we need government services for, like getting a document is outrageous. Why the he’ll do we pay taxes to fund government agencies local/state/etc and then still pay fees?
That’s double taxation. I think that’s the real fight on poor people. That document fee is over some people’s hourly wage, but yet it’s required.
That’s about like having to be in debt in order to build credit. It all serves to take money from working class to wealthy.
You are stuck on the fees.
Again-
You need time off to go to get the ID. Work may not give you the time off.
You need to pay for transportation to get the ID. You may not be able to afford to.
You need the documentation to get the ID. You may not have it.
It is not just the fees.
Cool, please show evidence of any sort of major voter fraud that was solved by requiring voter IDs. Good luck.
Can anyone prove definitely that corrupt politicians are trying to keep poor voters from voting?
Still seems like an assertion that’s a matter of opinion.
Did anyone throw the same fit about driving cars? You have to take the same time off work and get all the same documents to do literally every other civil function: legally drive to work, open a bank account for direct deposit, get a credit card, get medical treatment, get insurance, file taxes, etc. You have to pay for transportation to the grocery store if you don’t have a car.
Why is just one political group making a fuss about it, which seems to be really focus on voting? You only vote once in a while. You do or use those other examples every day.
I feel like a larger issue is just being exploited for political people to make victom statements.
Why is voting less important to prove identity than buying alcohol?
I’m not a citizen of this country. You’re saying I can/should vote? That’s illegal, but what stops me. I could do it a bunch of times too, I just go to different places.
Because Republicans don’t want the poor to be voting. Especially if those poor people aren’t white. Do you really find it shocking that Republicans do better if black people aren’t able to vote? Because that’s what Jim Crow was all about.
Even the All-American League of Women Voters is against it because it’s racist and classist. https://www.lwv.org/blog/whats-so-bad-about-voter-id-laws
No, that’s why you register to vote. You can’t vote with an ID if you haven’t registered. And for all of my life until this ID nonsense, they just checked your signature against the address you registered and you could vote.
If you tried to do some sort of fraudulent voting, you would have to somehow register to vote multiple times.
You know what you also couldn’t do? Register to vote multiple times, even if you didn’t have an ID, because you had to show something very simple like an official bill to your address and you could register.
Again- you find me evidence that there was massive voter fraud that ID stopped. The fact is, it didn’t stop any fraud, but it did stop a lot of poor black people from voting.
Again, read the League of Women voters link. Note that the very first headline is:
Voter Photo ID Laws Won’t Prevent Voter Fraud
The second is:
ID Laws as Voter Suppression
It will explain the whole thing even better than I can.
Although I’m sure you can find a reason to discount anything that the largest nonpartisan voting advocacy group in the nation, which has been around for more than a century, is full of shit. Let’s hear it.
How do all these poor people do everything else?
How do they drive cars, buy cars, get paid, etc?
I can understand dealing in all cash, but you can’t legally drive cars with a DL. Is that racist? This logically means requiring motorists to have ID is racist and discrimination right?
@redfox @FlyingSquid the poor people in my neighborhood take the bus everywhere, or walk, or car pool
So, it’s reasonable to assume they’d mostly have no need for a driver’s license?
What about the other things? How do you buy beer without a DL? I know broke people who still buy beer.
I’m still having a hard time imaging not having one at all.
Lots of them don’t drive cars.
I’m not sure why you think poor people all have cars. Cars cost a lot of money.
I don’t think you understand what “poor” means.
I believe you might be right about that.