“To those people who are saying, ‘Well, I can’t support Harris because she disagrees [with] Trump on that issue’ … he will be closer to Netanyahu,” Sanders said on CNN’s “State of the Union.”
Sanders said he thinks Vice President Harris can be moved “on that issue” of the Israel-Hamas war.
Harris has called for a cease-fire deal and pushed for the war in Gaza to end, but she faces scrutiny from both sides — from people who want to see Hamas defeated and those who call for the end of the war in Gaza.
“So, if we are able to elect Harris, I think we’re going to have an opportunity to move her on that issue, to make it clear, we cannot allow children in Gaza to starve to death,” Sanders said. “She will be open to that. I doubt that Trump will.”
to not vote in protest is to fall for a Russian troll campaign
It is to be an enabler of greater suffering, whether Dimitri had anything to do with it or not.
Perhaps some people are just morons or evil. Dimitri’s efforts might be irrelevant.
That’s the thing, tankies don’t care about Palestine, in fact I’d bet a good chunk of their numbers are IDF counterintel psyops.
It’s clear after a year of listening to tankies that they want gazans wiped off the face of the earth 🤷
Tankies are the libest libs of them all lmao
In before we get lectured about how this old white Jew is really BlueMAGA…
Or how Harris and Trump are BoTh ThE sAmE!!1! because Harris hasn’t screamed from the rooftops that what’s happening in Gaza is horrible.
because Harris hasn’t screamed from the rooftops that what’s happening in Gaza is horrible.
On the other hand, why hasn’t she?
AIPAC
We’ll see how she reacts after the election.
AIPAC
A lobbying organization that represents the interests of a foreign apartheid state should not enjoy so much influence.
We’ll see how she reacts after the election.
I’m worried that Democrats will interpret it as a mandate to maintain course regarding Gaza.
lol what you think if trump wins they’re going to learn anything but “we didn’t support Israel enough”?
The thought process is basically: If we win, it’s because we moved to the right. We should move to the right more. If we lose, it’s because we didn’t move far enough to the right. We should move to the right more.
I’m worried so too, but the domestic stakes are too high this late in the game to worry about much else.
With Trump they can just bribe him directly since real elections will no longer be necessary.
I wonder if anyone told Joe Biden this?
The problem is, Joe can’t be the first to seize power, because that act would end democracy.
Also, to end democracy you need the buy in from most of the administrative state.
That’s the huge part of project 2025. Dismantling and rebuilding the administrative state into something that will support authoritarianism.
Biden has not, and will not, do any of that work for a future dictator.
I mean AIPAC isn’t going anywhere after she gets elected. The most we’re going to hear are some more terse words. Israel and Russia are both fighting for control of this country, and whoever makes it to the president’s spot isn’t going to change that anytime soon.
We have a pretty serious fight in this country too not support Israel in this war.
AIPAC has shown that they will absolutely throw an election against anyone who condemns the genocide. If she does the right thing, AIPAC will put their full weight behind Donald “Biden is holding Netanyahu back” Trump
If no candidate can do the right thing in the face of genocide because a foreign apartheid state will pay for them to lose, this election is not about protecting democracy in the US. Democracy is already dead in the US, and we’re colonies again. This election is about choosing which toady will implement the will of our owners.
If he talks like BlueMAGA, he must be BlueMAGA
And what does that make you?..
A remnant of Saddam Hussein’s shit he left behind when he got yanked from his hidey-hole?
Wanna tell that to these Palestinians? It is patronizing colonialism to suggest you know better than they do.
I’m sure they will be ecstatic to know that they may soon be getting bombed by a brown woman. That will make their lives so much easier as they’re still trying to dig their children out of the rubble.
Oh good point, I guess those Palestinians forgot all about the bombing and dead children and digging out their families when they said they prefer Harris to Trump.
You ain’t no fucking ally, so don’t pretend to be one. Responding to “Palestinians seem to prefer Harris” with “they’ll be ecstatic that a brown woman is bombing them” is infantilising them and their opinions. It’s disgusting.
Just say it, “anticolonialist”. Say what you really mean, and that you know better than all of us brown people about what’s best for us. Go on, continue to deride our difficult choices and tell us how much better you know than us.
You aren’t living up to your username, and I hope that makes you second guess things. As a brown guy you’re no better than a colonialist in my eyes. And I think my people have had enough of you.
They said no such thing, OP post is gaslighting bullshit
You lie again 🤷
This is what I’m referring to. Palestinians hopeful that Harris will bring change and feeling encouraged that she’s rebuked Netanyahu.
If people digging out their dead children can be hopeful that she’ll bring change, instead of cynical, perhaps you should follow their example.
rebuked Netanyahu.
Which is as meaningless as her calls for a ceasefire while still supporting endless money and weapons
you have to hand it to the “vote 3rd party” tryhards: they never shut the fuck up with their stupid bullshit
As far as we know, it’s just one guy in Moscow named Dimitri with a bunch of burner accounts.
Because the vast majority of them aren’t real.
they never shut the fuck up
Just wait til the day after the election thru the following 3.5 years
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You can’t blame em for wanting better
Blaming people for wanting better is basically what lemmy is for.
Let’s ignore that fascism coming from within so we can focus on the other fascism.
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Is it so strange to think that a Trump win would have worse outcomes than a Harris win?
Is it so reprehensible to be dissatisfied with “not as bad as trump”?
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Already voted for Harris.
You just want critics of genocide to shut up and be as happy as you are about it.
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What should be and what is are almost never the same thing. We should keep pushing for what should be while facing the hard truths of what the reality actually is.
Try it. Try pushing against genocide regardless of who supports it.
See what happens.
I am, I’m still voting for the candidate I think I can help move on the issue instead of just letting the guy who will send the military against protestors win.
It’s the same damn result. They only answer to the donor class
Your second sentence does not imply your first, and if you pay any attention you’ll see significant differences. My LGBTQ+ friends and family, for example, will not have the same experience under each party. Nor will women or Black people. Nor will schoolteachers or schoolkids, or anyone depending on all kinds of public services.
Yes, both parties are corporatist, capitalist, and pay more attention to the rich. But only one is preparing a fascist theocracy and promising revenge on everyone who doesn’t match their narrow template for an acceptable human being. To say both parties are the same reveals a certain ignorance and perhaps the privilege not to be affected directly by the differences.
You can only speak in 3rd person about LGBTQ issues, I can speak in 1st hand. I’ve seen time and again for decades that dems have betrayed my community while demanding our unquestioning support. Harris throwing trans under the bus last week is a prime example
Harris throwing trans under the bus last week is a prime example
Do you have a link for this? I don’t remember her saying anything of the short.
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Less myopic and more privileged. Glad theyre in such a position to feel smugly while others suffer.
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While you advocate for the people keeping them marginalized
Enjoy your new openly fascist right wing party.
And you go enjoy your well-aged fascist party 🥳🥳
Let’s expedite the fascism coming from within so there are no brakes on fascism elsewhere…
Paycheck ends in 10 days finish strong!
I mean Trump just literally said the Netanyahu needs to do whatever he needs to do.
I always feel better when Bernie comes out and drops these truth bombs. He is an absolute national treasure, very presidential
I don’t want to hear you guys every say you want old people out of politics, while you simp for this old, ineffectual mummy. He needs to go away with the rest of the geriatrics and let the young policy makers take over
He is right. Trump will do whatever the evangelical hard right want, which in the case of the Middle East is to pump as much support, weapons, and money into Israel, purely so they can trigger Armageddon and try to fulfill their wet dreams of Supply-Side Jesus coming down off his cloud. Also doesn’t help that trump is a flagrant racist who would be happy to see more ‘brown-skinned’ people die.
Trump is not going to support peace. He will go all in on full genocide or apartheid.
So, Biden without the lip service?
Either way.
As is, Biden was and still is her boss. At least there’s a shot of organizing some kind of two state solution with her.
Trump with apartheid’s child whispering in his ear? Where’s that going to go?
1000% True.
Good on Sanders. It feels like he always has to be dragged kicking and screaming to support the party (and likely would be even more influential if he just played the game) but he is a voice that people might listen to.
That said: It is important to remember that the majority of the “No, I want support genocide LA LA LA LA LA LA LA” crowd either listen to or are tankies that are, at best, useful idiots for putin et al. They don’t care about Palestine and they sure as hell don’t care about anyone else that trump et al will genocide if elected.
They don’t care about Palestine.
Way to gaslight people because they’re disagree with you.
Perhaps they should listen to what Palestinians want them to do.
Saving others some time:
Palestinians’ preference for Harris over Trump stems from the former US president’s policy towards Palestinian issues, such as recognizing Jerusalem as the capital of Israel in 2017 and moving the US embassy from Tel Aviv to Jerusalem the following year. These actions were seen by Palestinians as undermining their aspirations for East Jerusalem as the capital of a future Palestinian state and as a firm endorsement of Israeli sovereignty over the contested city.
In 2019, Trump recognized Israeli settlements in the West Bank as legal, in blatant defiance of international law, and halted US support for the United Nations Relief and Works Agency for Palestine Refugees in the Near East (UNRWA). This action was seen as tacit approval of Israel’s expansion into occupied Palestinian territories.
- I don’t think you know what the word “gaslight(ing)” means
- If people actually cared about the Palestinians they would advocate for harm reduction and any hope for them rather than all but guaranteeing their eradication under trump. It is a very slim chance but there is hope that the Kamala administration will at least give israel fewer bombs or demand they be used for things that benefit US interests (like attacking iran) rather than cheering on the genocide.
But, to elaborate, the Palestinians have a long history of mostly beiing a political tool. In the past, when there were chances to evacuate them as refugees, the majority of neighboring countries actively refused (ironically citing fears of Hamas led insurrections). But when it is a way to bleed resources out of israel they suddenly are all humanitarians.
And considering how many prominent mouthpieces are, at best, useful idiots for the tankies? It is hard to believe that suddenly, after everyone discovered Palestine existed on October 8th, that is truly the greatest issue facing the planet (especially when other active genocides are still ignored).
It is a very slim chance but there is hope that the Kamala administration will at least give israel fewer bombs or demand they be used for things that benefit US interests (like attacking iran) rather than cheering on the genocide.
If there’s only a very slim hope, then might as well let the Democrats lose so they at least have to posture.
In the past, when there were chances to evacuate them as refugees, the majority of neighboring countries actively refused (ironically citing fears of Hamas led insurrections).
Middle Eastern countries notoriously don’t represent their people, being dictatorships and all that.
But when it is a way to bleed resources out of israel they suddenly are all humanitarians.
Who are “they”?
It is hard to believe that suddenly, after everyone discovered Palestine existed on October 8th, that is truly the greatest issue facing the planet (especially when other active genocides are still ignored).
Many people only learned how bad things are in Palestine because of Israel’s genocide in Gaza. What’s so strange about that? Also the West is not actively intervening in those other genocides, which might not be palatable to some people but it’s much better than actively bankrolling one. Again, what’s the problem with not wanting to bankroll a genocide and increase the chance of being caught in another war in the Middle East? Also, have you not considered that many people (a quarter of either all Americans or Democrats, not sure which but you can find the numbers online) opposed Israel’s Apartheid regime but couldn’t speak out for fear of being labeled antisemites? Also why are you conveniently ignoring the existence of Arab and Muslim Americans who are personally invested in seeing Israel’s genocide stop?
I don’t think you know what the word “gaslight(ing)” means
“No you don’t care about Palestine tankie/useful idiot/right wing bot/whatever” is, in fact, gaslighting.
All those words and not a damn message anywhere.
Real shame.
closer is an understatement
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Who is “they” in your comment?
We will kill them slowly vs we will kill them faster.
For a year now instead of escalation, the democrats allow Israel to commit a genocide in Gaza, continue genocide in west bank, attack Lebanon, attack Iran, attack Yemen.
All three ask for is “ stop genocide in Gaza “
Seems like one choice is clearly better. Sure things aren’t perfect but the decision should be clear.
For you, if you are okay with these two options that great. Other people refuse to be part of the killing of their people and you cannot force them to take your position.
It’s a trolley problem there is not a third option, you have to choose. Are you pulling the lever or complicit with whatever trump is going to do in office?
It’s absolutely wild to me that people act like there is some magically viable third option at this point.
It’s wild that “Harris should change” is interpreted in all cases by people who don’t want her to as third party/trump support.
All she needed was to say: " what Israel is doing is an acceptable, I withdraw my support to Biden, and I am running on a peaceful foreign policy" or any other lies she need to do to secure the votes and make everyone happy. But she insists on doing nothing which makes me wonder why.
All she needed was to say: " what Israel is doing is an acceptable, I withdraw my support to Biden, and I am running on a peaceful foreign policy"
No, you don’t understaaaaaand! Because of this new convenient rule of decorum we just made up, she caaaaaan’t differ from Biden in any substantive way! Unless it involves clumsy attempts to appease the fascist party, like promising to put one of them in her cabinet!
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Or start spewing abuse when people think that politicians should stop supporting genocide, as seen here.
Slow death is far more preferably then it isn’t incurable and terminal. It creates an opportunity to stop the death. A peace agreement a year from now under Harris means way more people are still alive than if it’s under Trump.
That’s all that should matter. Slowing it gives time for intervention and for an opposition coalition to grow. This conflict has been going on for decades. Do you really believe things would be better if Israel just killed everyone 20 years ago? Do you believe things will be better if Israel kills everyone now, versus this conflict still existing in 20 years?
Consider to what actual Palestinians in Gaza are saying. They have a clear preference for Harris over Trump.
No the don’t, their position is clear that both are evil and they don’t care who is running the show. Their position is to resist even without a gun they will pickup a rock ot a stick. Their position is the rather die fighting than dying on bed a slow death.
Yeah, no. Look at what they’re actually saying. Their position is that they’re hopeful Harris will bring a difference and they’re impressed that she’s rebuked Netanyahu.
If I was in a swing state then I would vote for Harris to prevent Trump from getting in, but I’m not in a swing state so I’m going to vote for a candidate that I actually like.
Since my state (California) would never turn red, the best thing I can do in my vote is to help my actual preferred candidate get access to campaign funds.
But again, I do think those in swing states should do whatever they can to prevent Trump from getting in.
Sensible!
He’s as delusional as the rest of BlueMAGA. He’s being the good little sheepdog he’s always been.
Reeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee
LOL blueMAGA. The most ridiculous attack I have seen in a while. It is like saying Palestinians are blueIDF.
BlueIDF seems like a more fitting moniker for the centrist wing of the Democratic party than BlueMAGA does.
