Early TNG is in fact PEAK Roddenberry.
Star Trek to me will always be the story and misadventures of a post-Utopian humanity.
I’m sorry, but any of the dystopian or counter-utopian or tearing down utopia series feel not just not like Star Trek to me, but fully contrary to it.
I have a feeling that, of all the Treks he didn’t produce, he’d have liked Lower Decks the most. It’s still mostly “humans got better” future, which I think was his core tenant.
TNG was also very much — not utopian; I can’t think of a word that implies that the human race evolved socially; “utopia” would imply everything was perfect for everybody. But he obviously hoped we’d be progressive.
I love DS9, but it’s a step backwards socially. There’s a darkness in the Federation. It’s there in most of the other series, post-TNG, and maybe a little in later TNG seasons, too.
The culmination of all this is the newest series, Section 31. All of Roddenberry’s ideals have simply been shit-canned. The Federation has a black ops section that’s basically cold war CIA; they go around assassinating people and manipulating cultures.
I think this just reflects the zeitgeist. It’s hard to be optimistic now, whereas when ST:TOS was produced we were on the moon, the cold war was fading, and mankind was reaching for the stars. TOS reflects that, and Section 31 reflects exactly how optimistic we are about the future, and current affairs.
It’s depressing. And - to get back to my premise - while Lower Decks was faithful to cannon, and didn’t ignore Section 31, I felt it captured the original general optimism about the future: that we’d be a better, more progressive society. And I think that would have appealed to Roddenberry.
You hit the nail on the head.
The best Trek is the one you like the most.
What is NOT up for debate is that the best intro song is from Enterprise.
The best Trek is the one you like the most
It’s like the people who complain how bad SNL is these days. When it always gets summed up by SNL was best when [first started watching it in HS/College and most of the topical references were things I understood at the time]
It’s been a long road for me to come to a point in my life where I agree with you.
I liked Firefly’s way better:-)
Omg this is my favorite image on all of Lemmy now:-).
I second that … and if you’ve only ever watched a few episodes or a movie or one series and that’s enough for you, then that’s fine.
I love engaging with Trek fans about Trek stuff but it isn’t fun when you’re made to feel less for not watching or knowing everything.
The majority of Trek fans I’ve ever run into love any of the shows so much, they’re just happy to talk about any of it.
Remember when it was just Enterprise
No bloody A, B, C, or D.
You could tell the speed we were traveling by the feel of the deck plates.
The “standard” Star Trek for me by which I compare others to is TNG, because I grew up in the 80s and 90s. TOS I guess is great for getting it off the ground but I just can’t relate to the 60s aesthetics, feels like I’m watching an old episode of The Munsters or I dream of Jeannie. I’m not from that time, and it feels very campy to me.
It’s a thing you can’t get back, a melange of culture and society and media technology and drugs. It was absolutely the best, and still is, in many ways. It was almost done in a vacuum, because the fanbase wasn’t there yet (they were becoming fans) and there was no instant polling or trending media other than the basic ones they had in the 60s. The studio, even the actors, weren’t getting a good picture of how huge it was.
With DS9, as an example, you get all the cool things and you also get to speculate about why this is the way it is, and what they were trying to do with that and if they thought the other was going to make the show a certain way or not, etc. . . . With TOS you get what you get. Star Trek, original, home made, artisinal episodes with 100% pure Shat and a Spock/McCoy overtone blend on a shoestring with everyone but the fans laughing at or ignoring them. Watching it now and kind of going back to the future is big fun if you can get to it. I totally understand if people can’t, but don’t dismiss it - it’s the only one you actually need to grok to love Star Trek.
Early TNG feels pretty campy too. I watched a lot of TNG and some DS9 in the early 90s (with some VOY/ENT and obviously the movies) but only really took it at face value. It wasn’t until post-college (05-06) with a lot of free time & streaming that I’d marathon TNG and DS9 and was able to really start to appreciate it all.
Wasn’t Gene involved in the early seasons of TNG?
Not only that, he said that it more closely captured his vision.
That’s what I was thinking too.
I’m pretty sure he’s credited as [executive] producer or something
Forgot The Orville.
TNG fanfic
Hi-ooooooooo
All versions of Star Trek have their high and low points. The debate should be which ones managed to do that enough times. Because that’s more of a subjective measure people are going to differ on what they like, so we get the disagreement of what’s “best” or “real”. In the end they all are tied to the Star Trek universe and concepts, just aren’t the same in how they present and tell the stories. I don’t like Discovery for a number of reasons, but I have seen a few parts where it felt TOS/TNG Star Trek level for a bit.
And I know this is just visual media, but I’m a rarity who likes the alternate future of the Star Fleet Battles board game that was based on TOS ships and history but expanded much differently ways. TNG and later loosely used some of the ideas in their various plots. The Borg are absolutely a variant of the Andromedans, sans a cube ship.
The mental disorder of Lower Decks is ADHD.
Prodigy isn’t a mental disorder. It’s just not yet fully grown.
And a lot of slapstick
I started trying to place them on a triangle with the three corners labelled “good trek”, “bad trek”, and “not trek” but I soon ended up arguing against my own choices of where I’d put them.
I disagree. The orville is more trek than most new series. I also can’t recommend the podcast “Star Trek Outpost” enough. It’s brilliantly made.
It’s genuinely TNG fanfic
Where do the Star Trek Christmas Specials fit in?
I’m by no means a Trekkie as much as I am a Gater, but didn’t TNG get immensely better after Roddenberry stopped being able to give input and make weird episodes?
It definitely became something… different after season 1 when he stopped contributing
