• SaltSong@startrek.website
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      1 day ago

      What if I blew up a water tower?

      Or burned down every grocery store in the city? (At night, while no-one was there to get hurt)

      • mako@lemmy.today
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        1 day ago

        Who is the intended audience of that comment that you believe will equate sources of food and water to swasticars?

        • SaltSong@startrek.website
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          1 day ago

          He didn’t say “swasticars.” He said “property.” Property damage can absolutely be violence against civilians.

          My audience would be anyone tempted to think that planting a burning cross in the yard of a black family does not count as violence against civilians, because it’s just property damage.

          • mako@lemmy.today
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            1 day ago

            Hahahaha, you went and one-upped your own stupid comment. Yes, clearly any rational person sees vandalizing swasticars to be just as evil as destroying essential infrastructure for human survival or terrorizing innocent people with racial hatred that has historically let to their murders.

            You’re a fucking idiot cosplaying as an iNTelLecTuAl.

            You’re also blocked because you’re a waste of everyone’s time.

          • guldukat@lemmy.world
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            23 hours ago

            I wonder where you were when that guy showed up and beat Paul Pelosi almost to death with a hammer. Laughing probably, along with most Republicans

            • SaltSong@startrek.website
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              19 hours ago

              Why do you think that? Because I’m trying to get us to make a sensible argument rather than a simple, incorrect argument?

      • MooseyMoose@lemmy.world
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        1 day ago

        Then your act of vandalism/sabotage would have effects that harms people. Is this so difficult for you to understand? SMH.

        • SaltSong@startrek.website
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          1 day ago

          It’s quite easy to understand. But you said “Property damage is not violence against civilians.”

          Clearly property damage can be violence against civilians.

          • Jax@sh.itjust.works
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            23 hours ago

            Yeah, I get the argument that you’re trying to make, but this is a really shitty time to play devil’s advocate.

            • SaltSong@startrek.website
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              19 hours ago

              I’m not playing devil’s advocate. I’m trying to get people on my side of the political divide to stop supporting their ideas with falsehoods. That is one way the right wing is able to attract a certain kind of adherent. They just have to point to things like this, where we say, and support, a false idea that we demonstrably don’t even believe ourselves.

              If our ideas are good, we only need the truth to make them look good.

              • Jax@sh.itjust.works
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                9 hours ago

                Falsehoods? Like equating municipally owned water towers and privately owned charging stations?

                You’re 100% playing devil’s advocate and drawing false equivalencies. Trying to sound like what you’re saying matters only works when what you’re saying… actually matters.

                • SaltSong@startrek.website
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                  6 hours ago

                  Falsehoods? Like equating municipally owned water towers and privately owned charging stations?

                  No falsehoods like “property damage isn’t violence against civilians,” when we both know perfectly well it can be.

                  “False equivalency” seems to be another way of saying that you can’t defend your position without illustrating that you define “violence against civilians” based on how much you like the civilians in question.

                  • Jax@sh.itjust.works
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                    5 hours ago

                    “False equivalency” seems to be another way of saying that you can’t defend your position without illustrating that you define “violence against civilians” based on how much you like the civilians in question.

                    You’ve just proven my point for me. You’re arguing pedantry in favor of billionaires, literally playing devil’s advocate.

                    Sincerely, fuck off.

      • MooseyMoose@lemmy.world
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        1 day ago

        I don’t consider property destruction “violence”. Violence for me can only occur if there is a nervous system involved. Defining it otherwise seems a bit disingenuous, imo. Vandalism is not the same as an act against a person or animal.

        • red_bull_of_juarez@lemmy.dbzer0.com
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          1 day ago

          If I break into your home and trash the place, it’s not violence? You should speak to people who experienced that. Granted, this is between real people and not corporations. And there is a line, somewhere, between vandalism and destruction where it turns to violence. It’s compIicated. I just completely disagree with the statement that destruction of property is never violence.

          • MooseyMoose@lemmy.world
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            1 day ago

            They try to make it equivalent so they can classify people who smash windows in protest as “violent criminals” in order to increase the penalties which is a complete mischaracterization. If the act of vandalism has knock on effects then those are separate from the act itself and should be dealt with separately.