• peanuts4life@beehaw.org
      link
      fedilink
      arrow-up
      62
      ·
      1 year ago

      Both. Fascist apologist like to cherry pick palatable characteristics of figures like Stalin, or Hitler, or Andrew Jackson in order to destigmatize thier idolatry of these figures. These “certain aspects” are the tip of the wedge they use to destroy rationality and peace.

      A reasonable person who would like to discuss the benefits of communism would point to the value of labor, advantages of unions, and the dignity of the worker, not the evil, paranoid, and violent person of Stalin.

      Always, the stink of fascism follows the idolization of so called “great men.” Excuses after excuses.

        • peanuts4life@beehaw.org
          link
          fedilink
          arrow-up
          53
          ·
          edit-2
          1 year ago

          The Holocaust most definitely happened and was perpetuated by the Nazis. Please don’t accuse me of denial.

          Communism, or to be most specific, Marxism, was most definitely aligned against Hitler.

          Stalin, was not. He would have watched Hitler kill all of Europe had the Nazis not attacked Russia. Same as the united states if Japan had not attacked them.

            • peanuts4life@beehaw.org
              link
              fedilink
              arrow-up
              40
              ·
              1 year ago

              I’m not obsessed with Stalin. I’m also not a Holocaust denier. You really seem keen on saying inflammatory things about me without any preceding context.

              I will observe that I think Stalin was an awful person who tarnished the reputation of socialism for a century. I don’t have anything against socialist, being one myself.

              I have a beef with apologist for failed communist states like the soviet onion. I feel they deeply misrepresent socialism.

                • peanuts4life@beehaw.org
                  link
                  fedilink
                  arrow-up
                  18
                  ·
                  edit-2
                  1 year ago

                  It’s a semantic argument, then. To me a fascist is a Donald Trump. To me, Facisim is a broad set of characteristics which can be attributed to people outside of the context of Nazi Germany. For example, I might call an ancient emperor a fascist.

                  Facisim to you is a political movement linked only to the Nazis and thier allies.

                  That’s not unfair. It’s a different definition of the word.

            • SuddenDownpour@lemmy.world
              link
              fedilink
              arrow-up
              22
              ·
              1 year ago

              Your historical notes are technically correct, and Stalin did even attempt to reach a pact with France to limit the potential expansion of Nazi Germany. However, once those initiatives failed, Stalin had no issue about pacting with Hitler instead to invade third countries together, which highlights how Stalin’s first priority was improving his geopolitical position, rather than an ideological opposition to nazism.

            • Quereller@lemmy.one
              link
              fedilink
              arrow-up
              18
              ·
              1 year ago

              Do you deny the Molotov–Ribbentrop pact and the illegal attack on Poland by the Soviet union under its leader Josef Stalin?

        • peanuts4life@beehaw.org
          link
          fedilink
          arrow-up
          22
          ·
          1 year ago

          I am of the strong opinion that fascism doesn’t care if you call yourself a communist, a capitalist, or a Democrat. If someone promotes a state which strips the power of local and individual labor for it’s own use; cultivates violence as a means of domestic control; supports expansionism; and finally the consolidation of power under a personality; I oppose it, and call it what it is.

        • argv_minus_one@beehaw.org
          link
          fedilink
          arrow-up
          15
          ·
          1 year ago

          And then they killed millions of people to enforce Stalin’s autocracy. How, exactly, is that better than Hitler?

        • Fizz@lemmy.nz
          link
          fedilink
          arrow-up
          7
          ·
          1 year ago

          Because they were attacked. Otherwise they would have happily sat out of ww2.

          • yuritopia@lemmy.world
            link
            fedilink
            arrow-up
            2
            ·
            1 year ago

            Nazism as an ideology set out to eradicate those seen as impure, and two of the most prominent of those targeted groups were communists and Slavic people. Hitler literally wanted to kill everyone who identified as a socialist. To think that the USSR was unaware or tolerant of this fact is a truly awful take.

            • Fizz@lemmy.nz
              link
              fedilink
              arrow-up
              6
              ·
              1 year ago

              Wow a commie who doesnt know history, not surprising. Firstly I never said USSR didnt know what Germany was doing, I said they didnt care. This is backed up by history. Yes Hitler hated the soviets and they probably disliked him to but they tolerated him and his crimes against humanity enough to form an alliance and work together. A little timeline of events to refresh your memory: 1939 USSR signs a non aggression pact with Germany. This pact includes plans to divide eastern europe between USSR and Germany, a clause that prevents the USSR from allying or aiding enemies of Germany. Shortly after Germany and the USSR double team Poland and split it up between them. After Stalin used the attack to capture a few eastern european countries he asked to join the Axis powers treaty. Stalin was warned multiple times that Germany was preparing to backstab him but rejected the warnings as he thought they were so allies. After it was confirm that Hitler had betrayed him he spent several days sulking in his holiday house refusing to communicate with his generals.

              There is no way you can reasonably say that USSR disapproved of Hitlers action and Ideology. The only thing he would have had an issue with is that Hitler hated slavic people. He was even willing to put that aside because they both had authoritarianism in common.

          • BuGiJu@lemmy.world
            link
            fedilink
            arrow-up
            2
            ·
            1 year ago

            Omg please read a book, I beg you😭🙏. The USSR was basically the only country taking an active stance against fascists. Who supported the anti-fascist side in the Spanish civil war? That’s right the USSR, who allowed the fascists free reign in Europe? Right, the UK and France. The UK and France were happily appeasing the fascists as long as they weren’t threatened themselves.

            • Fizz@lemmy.nz
              link
              fedilink
              arrow-up
              8
              ·
              1 year ago

              Did you finish your book halfway through? Hitler and Stalin formed an alliance shortly after the Spanish civil war. Even though Hitler referred to Slavic people as untermench Stalin still signed treaties because they were at the end of the day both Fascist Authoritarian dictators and dont give a single fuck about committing crimes against humanity.

              • BuGiJu@lemmy.world
                link
                fedilink
                arrow-up
                1
                ·
                1 year ago

                What do you do when a rabid fascist neighbor is on the rise and the capitalist countries of Europe are not willing to enter a defense alliance? Poland was not friendly towards the USSR, so in the case that the USSR did not divide Poland, Poland would have been completely invaded by Nazi Germany which puts the fascists right at the doorstep of the USSR, which clearly is not an optimal situation.

                And you are really lacking any historical knowledge if you call Stalin fascist. The USSR under Stalin did the bulk of the work against fascism in Europe and it is a gross misappropriation to call Stalin or the USSR fascist.