• gibmiser@lemmy.world
    link
    fedilink
    English
    arrow-up
    174
    arrow-down
    11
    ·
    9 months ago

    Jews in Israel and internationally, please Stand up to your government. You know this is wrong. Kill the babies? Listen to what they are saying.

    Your government is fucked up. You have let fear and revenge drive your country to madness. Look in your hearts, would a loving and just God want this? I don’t care what any book says, look in your heart. You know this is wrong.

    • CaractacusPotts@lemmy.caOP
      link
      fedilink
      English
      arrow-up
      79
      arrow-down
      18
      ·
      9 months ago

      Every western government has been complicit in this genocide. USA most of all. None of this could have occurred had it not been for the funding and the diplomatic cover provided by our governments. It’s up to all of us to make it stop.

      • Aceticon@lemmy.world
        link
        fedilink
        English
        arrow-up
        20
        arrow-down
        2
        ·
        9 months ago

        Lets not include Spain and the Republic of Ireland on it, who have even tried to get the EU to sanction Israel for this.

        But yeah, the rest are a disgrace, after the US especially Germany, who once again because of the etnicity of the aggressors, unwaveringly supports their committing of genocide along etnic lines and were the political and media “elites” even deploy Goebbels-style propaganda on this against its own populations. It was pretty dissapointing for me to see that whilst the national socialist party of the german worker is gone (though at the hands of others, not because it was kicked out by the Germans themselves), their cold violent racist ways are alive and well, at least amongst the German “elites”.

      • taanegl@lemmy.world
        link
        fedilink
        English
        arrow-up
        5
        arrow-down
        13
        ·
        9 months ago

        Oh yeah? Pray tell, how do we do that? And mind you, you’ve also got Iran in play, Egypt is doing its thing, and they would both react in their own way.

        Like would you suggest NATO troops on the ground? How do you think Hamas would react to that?

        • CaractacusPotts@lemmy.caOP
          link
          fedilink
          English
          arrow-up
          29
          arrow-down
          2
          ·
          9 months ago

          What tactics has the West utilized against Russia that they have not employed against Israel?

          Economic sanctions. Apply them to Israeli leadership in the military and in politics. Plus Business leaders and bankers. Prevent Israeli banking institutions “from accessing SWIFT, the international system for financial transactions, and restricting access to Western financial markets.” Ban Israeli access to international goods and services import as well as export. Let’s see how long their military can go without oil.

      • gibmiser@lemmy.world
        link
        fedilink
        English
        arrow-up
        9
        arrow-down
        27
        ·
        9 months ago

        Well, I think the US public has been pretty vocal about this compared to most issues. People are really pissed at Biden. So don’t change the subject.

        I think it’s time we start publicly shaming Israelis and Jews who don’t make strong statements condemning the murder of civilians and protesting the reckless-at-best and seemingly genocidal actions of their government.

        • CaractacusPotts@lemmy.caOP
          link
          fedilink
          English
          arrow-up
          44
          arrow-down
          3
          ·
          9 months ago

          publicly shaming Israelis and Jews

          This is about Zionism. It’s not about Jews. If you make it about Jews you are falling for the Zionist tactic of equating the two. Do better

          • gibmiser@lemmy.world
            link
            fedilink
            English
            arrow-up
            4
            arrow-down
            11
            ·
            9 months ago

            Really I just meant the international community of Jewish people. Many of them have strong opinions about matters related to Israel.

            • gregorum@lemm.ee
              link
              fedilink
              English
              arrow-up
              23
              ·
              edit-2
              9 months ago

              As a member of the international community of Jews, I think what Israel is doing is monstrous and disgusting. But I am in no way responsible for what they do. I don’t live there, I’ve never been there, and I have zero ability to influence Israeli policy beyond expressing my disapproval, which I often do.

              Stop spreading the misinformation that Israel = all Jews.

              • gibmiser@lemmy.world
                link
                fedilink
                English
                arrow-up
                5
                arrow-down
                10
                ·
                edit-2
                9 months ago

                I understand your frustration at what I am saying, but I believe you have more influence over the Israeli people than I do as a non-jew. Am I wrong? I just imagine that Israeli jews would take more seriously and be more introspective after receiving critical comments from a fellow Jewish person, who presumably is more in tune with the worries and historical context of the Jewish community than a non Jewish person is.

                My opinion is more easily decried as antisemitic or ignorant and waved away. Yours is not.

                When Christians do horrible things in the name of god, don’t you think being called out by other Christians is going to carry some more weight?

                • gregorum@lemm.ee
                  link
                  fedilink
                  English
                  arrow-up
                  11
                  ·
                  edit-2
                  9 months ago

                  What would make you think this? Just because we happen to share an ethnicity doesn’t mean an entire nation will listen to me or give me any entitlement to tell them what to do. Nor is it my responsibility, as a Jew.

                  And people who make decisions based on ancient mythology aren’t exactly making rational decisions in the first place, so I don’t know why an appeal on that basis would work. I may be a Jew, but I’m also an atheist. The last thing this situation needs is more religion.

                  • gibmiser@lemmy.world
                    link
                    fedilink
                    English
                    arrow-up
                    1
                    arrow-down
                    8
                    ·
                    9 months ago

                    Unfortunately, there’s no commonly accepted distinction between Jews who practice Judaism, Zionists, and ethnic Jews, At least not that I’m aware of. I do recognize that there is a difference, And if I were you, I would be pointing out the difference also.

                    I’m sorry, man.It sounds like this is rough for you to be tied to these people by the Jewish label. I hope sometime in this century. All this b******* gets sorted out For everyone’s sake.

        • macrocephalic@lemmy.world
          link
          fedilink
          English
          arrow-up
          16
          ·
          9 months ago

          I think it’s time we start publicly shaming Israelis and Jews who don’t make strong statements condemning the murder of civilians and protesting the reckless-at-best and seemingly genocidal actions of their government.

          Are you deliberately trying to use the same language as was used against Muslims 20 years ago?

          • gibmiser@lemmy.world
            link
            fedilink
            English
            arrow-up
            1
            arrow-down
            5
            ·
            9 months ago

            No, I guess I don’t get your reference, unless you are referring to 911?

            If so it would be the Americans needing to condemn their government for invading Iraq, not the Muslims condemning 911.

    • Ð Greıt Þu̇mpkin@lemm.ee
      link
      fedilink
      English
      arrow-up
      44
      arrow-down
      3
      ·
      9 months ago

      Not exactly like every Jew is Israeli, in fact Israel is the one trying to force the narrative that they are, because it reinforces that narrative to those Jews when people actually do antisemitic shit

      It’s a settler recruitment strategy.

      • WaxedWookie@lemmy.world
        link
        fedilink
        English
        arrow-up
        14
        arrow-down
        3
        ·
        9 months ago

        Not to mention the view that being anti-genocide is antisemitic - a deeply stupid, dishonest, antisemitic position that gives the best possible justification one could give for the extermination of the Jews.

    • assassin_aragorn@lemmy.world
      link
      fedilink
      English
      arrow-up
      27
      arrow-down
      2
      ·
      9 months ago

      and internationally

      Jewish people have nothing to do with Israel. There is no greater burden on them than us