We’re moving the goal posts now. I don’t agree with his support of Israel. I get why it’s happening, I wish it wasn’t, and it is something I strongly oppose him on. However, the claim was that he said any protest of Israel is antisemitic, and it appears that this is untrue.
And this isn’t about “giving him the benefit of the doubt.” He literally answered a softball no-brainer question in the only sane way, and there is no amount of twisting that would make it make sense to assume he knew that they were talking only about 1 specific protest that was not antisemitic.
I’m not shifting the goal posts, i’m applying my knowledge of him and his past positions on Israel in my interpretation of that statement. I acknowledge there’s some ambiguity, but frankly, saying ‘he’s responding in the only sane way’ is a projection of your own position (e.g. not supporting israel) onto him and not grounded in his actions or past comments. Israel itself has come out and accused even those peaceful protests on Columbia’s campus of antisemitism with a very broad brush, and it’s a pretty clear effort to discredit legitimate criticism of their genocide in Palestine. Biden has repeatedly taken on the Israeli stance on geopolitical issues, even when evidence is in stark contrast (thinking specifically of his doubt of Gazan death tolls and fault of the israeli strikes on gaza hospitals). It isn’t a stretch to see this comment as yet another instance of him siding with the Israeli state position instead of acknowledging genuine opposition.
I think it’s generous to say you’re giving him the benefit of the doubt, rather than knowingly running cover for him in order to serve a broader goal of campaigning for his reelection. I think anyone who actually wants Biden to win reelection should be pressuring him to act on Israel, not taking every opportunity to deflect criticism away from him.
Even this explanation is a huge shift because he clearly doesn’t say it (which is what I’ve asked for), but you’re simply inferring it.
saying ‘he’s responding in the only sane way’ is a projection of your own position (e.g. not supporting israel) onto him and not grounded in his actions or past comments.
It’s funny that you can infer things about what he said, despite him not actually saying it, but when I question whether he has ever actually said any protest of Israel is antisemitic, and no one can provide me evidence that he has (basically basing it on past positions, or lack there of in this case), I’m “projecting” to point out that he doesn’t actually say it here either. You’re recognizing the faults of your own argument here, not mine.
I think anyone who actually wants Biden to win reelection should be pressuring him to act on Israel, not taking every opportunity to deflect criticism away from him.
There’s plenty of criticism of Biden to go around, especially when it comes to handling Israel and their invasion into Gaza, which is exact people shouldn’t be spinning every little thing into confirming what they already believe to be true because it just weakens legitimate claims.
I very clearly stated what I thought was being implied, and i’ve been trying to explain why it’s not unreasonable to interpret his comments the way I did given his previous comments and positions. There’s abundant examples of democratic leaders casting blame, suspicion, and condemnation toward anti-Israel protesters, including plenty of accusations of antisemitism.
Biden needed to be clear here if he wanted to erase any doubt about the implication. I suspect that this was actually the intent of whatever reporter who asked the question to begin with, but he’s been pretty consistent about siding with Israel and this is a question he should have been prepared for. He needs to be clear, he’s in no position to be wishy-washy with active protests so close to the election. I don’t think i’m being unreasonable with my interpretation given all of the above, even if it isuncharitable.
It’s funny that you can infer things about what he said, despite him not actually saying it, but when I question whether he has ever actually said any protest of Israel is antisemitic, and no one can provide me evidence that he has […] I’m “projecting” to point out that he doesn’t actually say it here either.
It’s not projecting to point out he doesn’t say something verbatim, but it is projection to assume his intended meaning was the ‘most sane’ one.
There’s plenty of criticism of Biden to go around, especially when it comes to handling Israel and their invasion into Gaza, which is exact people shouldn’t be spinning every little thing into confirming what they already believe to be true because it just weakens legitimate claims.
Fair enough, but no amount of criticism seems to stir action out of the most ardent liberal supporters; who are desperate to assign blame to critics on the left.
I get that he sides with Israel too strongly. I get that he is giving them too much support. I get that he needs to come out more forcefully to oppose their actions. None of this changes that he did not say any protest of Israel is antisemitic here. He was asked if he opposes antisemitic protests, and he responded in the affirmative. It’s a no brainer, simple to answer question. There is no logical way to spin this into him saying that any protest of Israel is antisemitic. It just makes zero sense.
Especially if we consider the next part of that statement where he says he also condemns people who don’t understand what’s going on in Palestine.
I get how you “reasoned” yourself there, it’s not that I’m confused by that, but you’re doing mental gymnastics and making massive jumps in order to justify this confirming what you already believe to be true, rather than approaching this the other way and asking yourself “what can I really get from this?”
It’s not projecting to point out he doesn’t say something verbatim, but it is projection to assume his intended meaning was the ‘most sane’ one.
I didn’t say his “intended meaning” was “the most sane.” I said his response to the question was the only sane one. Of course, you are going to have people who, no matter what he says, spin it into him trying to paint all protesters as antisemitic. But if he had tried to be “nuanced” about a question as to whether or not he opposes antisemitism, he runs the risk of being mistaken about something (like you are here when claiming there was no antisemitism there) and sounding like he is defending antisemitic protesters.
Again, total no-brainer. Whether he actually believes it or not is inconsequential, in fact. Politically speaking, there was no other good answer to that question. Without, of course, going into some super long-winded explanation that, again, especially if done off-the-cuff, runs many, many risks.
“I condemn antisemitism in all forms - but it is important to acknowledge that valid criticism of Israel is not antisemitic”
There you go.
Instead you get “i condemn people who don’t understand what’s going on with the Palestinians” which could mean fucking anything, including people who don’t understand what is going on with the Palestinians that justifies the response by Israel, which has been his position the whole fucking time.
I like how you’re pretending you don’t know what he meant by the second part, when it has been clear for a while now that, at least vocally, he doesn’t approve of how far Israel has gone and has repeatedly decried the humanitarian conditions in gaza, but it’s safe for you to assume he meant something he had never said by the first part.
We’re moving the goal posts now. I don’t agree with his support of Israel. I get why it’s happening, I wish it wasn’t, and it is something I strongly oppose him on. However, the claim was that he said any protest of Israel is antisemitic, and it appears that this is untrue.
And this isn’t about “giving him the benefit of the doubt.” He literally answered a softball no-brainer question in the only sane way, and there is no amount of twisting that would make it make sense to assume he knew that they were talking only about 1 specific protest that was not antisemitic.
I’m not shifting the goal posts, i’m applying my knowledge of him and his past positions on Israel in my interpretation of that statement. I acknowledge there’s some ambiguity, but frankly, saying ‘he’s responding in the only sane way’ is a projection of your own position (e.g. not supporting israel) onto him and not grounded in his actions or past comments. Israel itself has come out and accused even those peaceful protests on Columbia’s campus of antisemitism with a very broad brush, and it’s a pretty clear effort to discredit legitimate criticism of their genocide in Palestine. Biden has repeatedly taken on the Israeli stance on geopolitical issues, even when evidence is in stark contrast (thinking specifically of his doubt of Gazan death tolls and fault of the israeli strikes on gaza hospitals). It isn’t a stretch to see this comment as yet another instance of him siding with the Israeli state position instead of acknowledging genuine opposition.
I think it’s generous to say you’re giving him the benefit of the doubt, rather than knowingly running cover for him in order to serve a broader goal of campaigning for his reelection. I think anyone who actually wants Biden to win reelection should be pressuring him to act on Israel, not taking every opportunity to deflect criticism away from him.
Even this explanation is a huge shift because he clearly doesn’t say it (which is what I’ve asked for), but you’re simply inferring it.
It’s funny that you can infer things about what he said, despite him not actually saying it, but when I question whether he has ever actually said any protest of Israel is antisemitic, and no one can provide me evidence that he has (basically basing it on past positions, or lack there of in this case), I’m “projecting” to point out that he doesn’t actually say it here either. You’re recognizing the faults of your own argument here, not mine.
There’s plenty of criticism of Biden to go around, especially when it comes to handling Israel and their invasion into Gaza, which is exact people shouldn’t be spinning every little thing into confirming what they already believe to be true because it just weakens legitimate claims.
I very clearly stated what I thought was being implied, and i’ve been trying to explain why it’s not unreasonable to interpret his comments the way I did given his previous comments and positions. There’s abundant examples of democratic leaders casting blame, suspicion, and condemnation toward anti-Israel protesters, including plenty of accusations of antisemitism.
Biden needed to be clear here if he wanted to erase any doubt about the implication. I suspect that this was actually the intent of whatever reporter who asked the question to begin with, but he’s been pretty consistent about siding with Israel and this is a question he should have been prepared for. He needs to be clear, he’s in no position to be wishy-washy with active protests so close to the election. I don’t think i’m being unreasonable with my interpretation given all of the above, even if it is uncharitable.
It’s not projecting to point out he doesn’t say something verbatim, but it is projection to assume his intended meaning was the ‘most sane’ one.
Fair enough, but no amount of criticism seems to stir action out of the most ardent liberal supporters; who are desperate to assign blame to critics on the left.
I get that he sides with Israel too strongly. I get that he is giving them too much support. I get that he needs to come out more forcefully to oppose their actions. None of this changes that he did not say any protest of Israel is antisemitic here. He was asked if he opposes antisemitic protests, and he responded in the affirmative. It’s a no brainer, simple to answer question. There is no logical way to spin this into him saying that any protest of Israel is antisemitic. It just makes zero sense.
Especially if we consider the next part of that statement where he says he also condemns people who don’t understand what’s going on in Palestine.
I get how you “reasoned” yourself there, it’s not that I’m confused by that, but you’re doing mental gymnastics and making massive jumps in order to justify this confirming what you already believe to be true, rather than approaching this the other way and asking yourself “what can I really get from this?”
I didn’t say his “intended meaning” was “the most sane.” I said his response to the question was the only sane one. Of course, you are going to have people who, no matter what he says, spin it into him trying to paint all protesters as antisemitic. But if he had tried to be “nuanced” about a question as to whether or not he opposes antisemitism, he runs the risk of being mistaken about something (like you are here when claiming there was no antisemitism there) and sounding like he is defending antisemitic protesters.
Again, total no-brainer. Whether he actually believes it or not is inconsequential, in fact. Politically speaking, there was no other good answer to that question. Without, of course, going into some super long-winded explanation that, again, especially if done off-the-cuff, runs many, many risks.
“I condemn antisemitism in all forms - but it is important to acknowledge that valid criticism of Israel is not antisemitic”
There you go.
Instead you get “i condemn people who don’t understand what’s going on with the Palestinians” which could mean fucking anything, including people who don’t understand what is going on with the Palestinians that justifies the response by Israel, which has been his position the whole fucking time.
I like how you’re pretending you don’t know what he meant by the second part, when it has been clear for a while now that, at least vocally, he doesn’t approve of how far Israel has gone and has repeatedly decried the humanitarian conditions in gaza, but it’s safe for you to assume he meant something he had never said by the first part.
Convenient.