Ehh, in anarchism there’s a concept of nominated authority Vs compelled authority (not sure of the exact phrasing of either but you get the point). If a group of people voluntarily elect authority there isn’t really a problem with it.
“Down with all authority, except on a both figurative and literal anarchist plane/boat where the passengers all make the conscious informed and democratic* decision under no duress and a freedom of association that it’s in their best interests as a community to delegate decision making power for their community to the captain of said boat/plane as he has the knowledge and experience to navigate it.” doesn’t exactly roll off the tongue does it? Nor does it fit on a poster.
But the same is true in communities. Humans are in their initial state very atomized and individual we are not like ant colonies or bee colonies where by default the welfare of others is even a known subject to us, but as we seek to accomplish tasks, we voluntarily commit to some degree of communal benefit and to ensure this community lasts long enough to yield said benefit we learn to keep the peace and abide by some social norms within this community.
It sounds like conservative hell, but the nuanced position between that and hyper-individualistic self-expression is that as long as said communities aren’t coercive and association is voluntary, it’s kind of okay.
However one flaw in this take is something like the Amish. Is it ethical for say, Amish or some other community that willingly foregoes the benefits of modern technology to have children, who may find that growing up not surrounded by tech has reduced their development in some ways?
The answer to that one is obvious - to create free facilities and let communities form themselves. Right now youth centres have disappeared, teens are hurried out of any gathering space, play areas are regimented out of any joy or priced to prohibition and you end up with young people being left with the activity options of isolation, or group activities that are antisocial or involve substance abuse
create free facilities and let communities form themselves.
They don’t form themselves (or at least that’s a rare exception), and I think by now the teenagers are so fixated on online interactions that they will have a hard time adapting to, let alone create such spaces themselves.
The very act of providing space and resources means that it didn’t create itself.
There are rare exceptions where the community came first and they managed to acquire the space and resources later, but most of these places were quite intentionally set up to foster a community around them.
@poVoq
That’s not how i3Detroit started. It began with a group having an idea and making it happen.
You seem to assume that they couldn’t achieve something unless someone gave them a handout. The commercial makerspaces showed up later.
Expecting them to create without resources is like expecting a crop without planting seeds.
Communities don’t naturally form, they are a means to an end to a particular goal. Most people aren’t interested in being with like-minded folks “just because” these days, and very few people understand and relate to each other in general, due to atomized cultural backgrounds.
Ehh, in anarchism there’s a concept of nominated authority Vs compelled authority (not sure of the exact phrasing of either but you get the point). If a group of people voluntarily elect authority there isn’t really a problem with it.
“Down with all authority, except on a both figurative and literal anarchist plane/boat where the passengers all make the conscious informed and democratic* decision under no duress and a freedom of association that it’s in their best interests as a community to delegate decision making power for their community to the captain of said boat/plane as he has the knowledge and experience to navigate it.” doesn’t exactly roll off the tongue does it? Nor does it fit on a poster.
But the same is true in communities. Humans are in their initial state very atomized and individual we are not like ant colonies or bee colonies where by default the welfare of others is even a known subject to us, but as we seek to accomplish tasks, we voluntarily commit to some degree of communal benefit and to ensure this community lasts long enough to yield said benefit we learn to keep the peace and abide by some social norms within this community.
It sounds like conservative hell, but the nuanced position between that and hyper-individualistic self-expression is that as long as said communities aren’t coercive and association is voluntary, it’s kind of okay.
However one flaw in this take is something like the Amish. Is it ethical for say, Amish or some other community that willingly foregoes the benefits of modern technology to have children, who may find that growing up not surrounded by tech has reduced their development in some ways?
The answer to that one is obvious - to create free facilities and let communities form themselves. Right now youth centres have disappeared, teens are hurried out of any gathering space, play areas are regimented out of any joy or priced to prohibition and you end up with young people being left with the activity options of isolation, or group activities that are antisocial or involve substance abuse
They don’t form themselves (or at least that’s a rare exception), and I think by now the teenagers are so fixated on online interactions that they will have a hard time adapting to, let alone create such spaces themselves.
@poVoq
Have you ever seen a Makerspace or Hackerspace? Youth are just fine at creating community when they have the resources.
@Taleya @solarpunk
The very act of providing space and resources means that it didn’t create itself.
There are rare exceptions where the community came first and they managed to acquire the space and resources later, but most of these places were quite intentionally set up to foster a community around them.
@poVoq
That’s not how i3Detroit started. It began with a group having an idea and making it happen.
You seem to assume that they couldn’t achieve something unless someone gave them a handout. The commercial makerspaces showed up later.
Expecting them to create without resources is like expecting a crop without planting seeds.
I explicitly said that there are rare exceptions 🤷♂️ And no one even mentioned commercial makerspaces.
Please don’t assume that others assume things they neither said nor implied.
@poVoq
Okay. You win the internet.
I have no idea what you’re implying, assuming or using as a metric for what is rare or not.
Communities don’t naturally form, they are a means to an end to a particular goal. Most people aren’t interested in being with like-minded folks “just because” these days, and very few people understand and relate to each other in general, due to atomized cultural backgrounds.
This has nothing to do with literally anything I said