I hate this, because the idea comes from Hermetic spirituality, but from a very cherry picked version of it that basically says “Be as shitty a person as you want, give into your natural inclinations and vices”
I know because I’ve seen this A LOT!
Because the actual Seventh Principle of Hermeticism does not say to do this, it actually says to balance the masculine and feminine within yourself to acknowledge both as being geniunely within you. It also encourages that the two shouldn’t be seen as opposites but rather two endpoints on a vast spectrum, the same way we see hot and cold.
But sadly too many “Gurus” somehow warped this into
“Reject femininity, see it as weakness, and be a massive chauvinistic asshole.”
When that couldn’t be further from what it’s saying.
The gender identity of your work places energy is not the damn problem. Raise the damn pay. People will work in a sewer if you paid enough.
I think what most companies actually need is more QA energy 😅
Maybe, but he’s damn sure cucked. Dude 100% has a chair in the corner of his bedroom facing the bed.
Zuck: “we never let gender play a role in our hiring process.”
Also Zuck: “yeah, we need to hire more men.”
It’s the old “Male is normal, Female is special” logical fallacy, he only wants to hire people who’d get hired under “Normal” circumstances
He knows he’ll never make up the loss of subscribers on the left since he’s burned those bridges so he has to double down on the far right to carry his platform.
This way he gets to compete with X for a race to the bottom and see who can gather the most shitbags to support their plateauing businesses.
“he has to” does he though? He has enough money for him and his entire lineage to live lavishly for eternity. He can dip out today and stop working forever, relax on a beach, and disconnect from the world like Tom from MySpace did.
He’s not being forced to do anything.
Listen to the latest zuck episode of jre and he actually sounds pretty reasonable. I know that’s crazy but if you have a couple hours you can actually listen to the dude.
Edit: just to be clear I’m not saying I love the guy, or even like him. But listening to him talk for 2 hours he is atleast semi intelligent and is trying to keep free speech alive.
sitting through any length of jre is going to either waste your time or expose you to hours of garbage.
why?
Watched the episode. Completely disagree. His whole schtick was “yeah moderation is really hard yet super important to get right, that’s why as a cost cutting measure we are curtailing the entire operation lol.”
He explained it wasn’t even about the cost. Yes it’s expensive but he willing to throw billions at it for years. It’s not working and that’s the problem.
They are unable to read every single thing posted. So they use ai. But ai makes mistakes. So you can let the ai be more lenient and say ban accounts that it is 50% sure is a bot. But then the ai bans a lot of real accounts by accident. There is no winning and they were fighting a loosing battle constantly with no rock solid answer. Idk the answer to it but neither does meta. It’s not their fault a third of the population of earth uses there services everyday. It’s a lot to monitor and every step they take to make it better the bots/badguys take another step and are always on step ahead. It’s a losing battle for everyone involved except the bots. So they are gonna try leaving it up to the individual to figure out what’s what. It’s that or they try to be mommy and daddy and treat their users like babies.
That’s why everybody should migrate to smaller platforms - The internet is decentralized by design and people use these stupid sites that swallow personal data and regurgitate propaganda.
And you believed him
About what? He’s not saying anything unbelievable.
“It’s not about cost.” Running an imperfect system expensively is not grounds to gut the system entirely.
I don’t believe it’s not about cost and in my opinion you’re silly to believe it. You fell for propaganda and even worse it was propaganda on Joe Rogan of all places lmao.
Okay agree to disagree. I think meta is a company/business and obviously is looking at cost vs impact etc. And they deemed it to expensive to continue fighting a losing battle. If you don’t like it don’t use meta which I’m sure you don’t. But I don’t blame them at all for coming to this decision and I don’t think they are responsible to teach you right from wrong either. Like I said it’s not their fault a third of the world uses their services everyday. They made a great social media site and its become one of if not the most popular on earth. But that’s all they are, a social media business. I wouldn’t blame a smaller business that came to similar conclusions that just impact less people. It happens all the time it’s just I think meta gets all the attention because it’s the biggest one. But it’s still just a company making money at the end of the day.
Zucklefuckle regularly lies and shifts about as much as a chameleon. His goal is to raise shareholder value and nothing more. He’s not worth listening to.
A down vote. Wow lmao shows how stuck in your ways you are. You’re just as bad as the right wing you hate.
lol no. Anyone who has paid any attention to Zuckerberg over the last 15 or so years will tell you the exact same thing: The dude is a lying opportunist who will say and do anything to bump his company stock. Musk and or Rogan are not your friends, they are feeding you bull shit.
I wasn’t talking about musk. Rogan is just a doofus with a show that I happen to enjoy but he himself will tell you he’s an idiot when it comes to almost anything that doesn’t include comedy or MMA of which I am a gigantic fan of both those things. Also yes, zuck is a business owner and nothing else. He wants his business to be the largest/most successful one, like every other business owner on earth. He just happens to be at the top. But I would expect him to be ruthless when it comes to running to his business, we live in a capatalisic society unfortunately don’t hate the player hate the game. I don’t think zuck has any personal responsibility to teach users right from wrong. He only had the reposibility of keeping his company making billions of dollars.
Rogan is just a doofus with a show that I happen to enjoy but he himself will tell you he’s an idiot when it comes to almost anything that doesn’t include comedy
And yet he routinely makes declarative statements like “climate science is people making you feel bad about your impact when we don’t even understand the science behind it”. He’s a right wing shill who consistently presents far right ideas like they’re truth, but then tongue in cheeks self deprecates, like it cancels out the massive soap box alt right haranguing he just did. He also consistently platforms far right racist, science denying fascists and then nods along while they drip venom in the ear of his brain-dead audience.
Zuckface’s refusal to take any responsibility for his company has gotten a lot of people killed all in the name of shareholder profits. Stop licking his boots. He has thrown you to the wolves along with the rest of us and you’re defending this dude who doesn’t even care who you are or that you even exist… seriously, why? You should also take the hint: A lot of people here, the people who are not being naive and see who he is, disagree with you.
If you’re not willing to listen to it then you’re part of the problem and you should stfu. Hate when people just for an opinion and haven’t even watched the fuckin thing. You are your own worst enemy you people
You are the other side of the coin you are criticising you knob.
The Billionares are not your friends.
The rhetoric of the right has shown time and time again that they will use disinformation and misinformation to conform their gullible audience towards whatever views suit their needs. Humanity continues to confirm his remarkable susceptible to this practice. This form of deceitful expression is not the ‘free speech’ a society should tolerate and why fact checking entities need to exist with the power to shutdown this discourse.
If you’re not willing to listen to it then stfu
You are just as bad as the right wingers you criticize all day. You don’t even watch the thing you just assume. You are the other side of the coin you constantly criticize and hate.
That would mean listening to Joe Rogan, and unfortunately I’d be too busy setting my hair on fire before I ever listened to Joe Rogan.
I actually have listened to Zuckface on a podcast once because I had never heard him talk. He definitely does some good masking as being a human person. And I think if he wasn’t evil he might have some interesting ideas, sure.
Shows me how smart you are. I don’t agree down vote! You didn’t even watch thing or reply with a reasonable comment. You’re not willing to. You are just as bad as the right wing you hate.
If you’re not gonna listen to it then just say so. You’re part of the problem and shouldn’t even reply since you have no clue what you are talking about. You didn’t even listen to thing your commenting about. Do you not see the problem.
Well no I’m not going to listen to 3 hours of intellectual dark web bros. But I did read this wonderful Bluesky fact check thread of what Zuckerberg had to say, which is much more what we should be listening to, instead of Rogan shooting the shit about how climate change isn’t real with Mel Gibson . https://bsky.app/profile/mmasnick.bsky.social/post/3lfgh7dbglk2d
Mel Gibson is insane Joe was trying to convince him of evolution and climate change.
Edit: see what you did right there that’s called misinformation.
No he wasn’t, his statement was about disliking being made to feel bad about climate science he doesn’t understand. You’re clearly deep in the Joe mental gymnastics brain rot.
This is dystopia. The people in control of society pushing insane spiritualist cult mentalities to obfuscate their role in a genocidal empire.
Is Zuck getting divorced?
I don’t think so, but don’t let that stop you from shooting your shot if your believe you can make him a happy man.
There has got to be better sexbot models out there.
LOL I would never! Unless it’s to get close enough to et tu brutus him
Dude loves Romans that much he would die proud I think.
Most companies just need more ppl that actually work rather than doing politics and profiting off of the 30% working personnel.
nah, they just need to fire some useless managers and reroute the pay to the workers https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BTdOHBIppx8
maybe you should start with humanoid energy you fucking lizardbot
I assume by more masculine energy, Zuckerberg means:
- More posturing by Matt Walsh, Ben Shapiro, Jordan Peterson and Donald Trump, the US exemplars of manhood.
- Trolls, more trolls, trolls trolling trolls. People fucking with anyone else that makes them uncomfortable.
- People boasting about how rich they are, how fast their car goes, and how many women they bed. Comparisons. Leaderboards.
- Doxing. So much doxing.
- So much AI porn. So much futa AI porn.
- So much misogyny. All the misogygy. Al Misogyny. Misogyny leaderboards.
- Tons of hate speech against the targets of the week. Immigrants, trans folk, Jews Arab Muslims, libs (not liberals, neoliberals or left-wingers, libs )
Essentially Zuck wants Facebook to become 4chan/b… or 4chan/pol, only where everybody knows your name.
I have to ask… do people even in that sphere who take that shit seriously actually consider Ben Fucking Shapiro (of all people) to be especially masculine??
You mean the man who can’t make his wife wet, and loudly proclaimed to the world that women don’t get wet down there?
And Jordan Peterson who fell into a coma from eating too much meat
Probably. As opposed to what masculine used to mean and should mean:
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Taking responsibility for your actions
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Taking leadership if you see nobody else is going to
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Treating others with respect
Of course, in modern times, we’ve realized this has nothing to do with masculinity or femininity and rather with one’s role in society. If you want to be respectable, these are just some of the things you should be doing.
Why are those considered masculine traits?
In the 1980s (when women just got to have their own bank accounts and credit cards, and we just invented no-fault divorce) there was still a lot of prejudice that women were too driven by emotions. My dad (a boomer) still believes this to this day.
The thing is, in the 1970s, we switched to two-income houses rather than the one-income houses of the 1950s. (Shit was evil then too, but that’s a different rant) and so women were required to do all this adulting that they allegedly couldn’t do. In the 1990s, women were regarded, at least by Gen-X and younger to be able to adult, and of which taking responsibility, being able to lead and / or follow without being a dick, and respecting others. If there was anything different, it was that men were expected to have higher incomes and be able to put more into rent, utilities, dating etc.
(I was dirt poor, but a solid friend so we went out less and ate in more. The VCR / DVD played the same role as Netflix in the Netflix-&-Chill paradigm.)
The way I put it came from the 1983 techno-thriller, Wargames, cut and pasted from a different thread, the man code was this:
🔸️ DON’T launch the LGM-30 Minuteman nuclear-tipped ICBM. Evar. Even if the President of the United States orders you to. (He’s bluffing.)
For most people it was allegory, but for some people, it’s a literal thing (also, I know of USAF missileers who admitted they would not launch even under orders, and they’ve been kept in the same post even during the cold war, so go figure.) Incidentally, women were assigned to missile posts, in 1977 in the USAF, so it seems that the US government trusted women with the decision to launch a nuclear weapon well before US culture got the memo.
Nowadays, we see masculinity as it’s expressed by politicians and pundits reminds me of Joffrey Baratheon insisting I am the king which I was specifically reminded of when Trump was strangling his own Secret Serviceman screaming I am the fucking president!
Any man who must say “I am the king” is no true king. – Tywin Lannister
I wouldn’t trust any of these bros not to abuse their lovers and kin, let alone with an LGM-30 Minuteman nuclear-tipped ICBM. But it seems seventy-seven million Americans trust that capacity to Trump.
My teachers were fierce about our capacity as fourth-graders to take responsibility seriously. Also to pronounce nuclear as NOO-klee-ur, so I had to cringe all the way through the George W. Bush era. It’s worse in the Trump era, watching my elders acting like overgrown toddlers.
I suppose it doesn’t have to be exclusively masculine. I’ll take what I could get if it could coerce some of these “must be manly” folks to actually aspire to good attributes versus what they seem to think masculinity means right now…
Because in a traditional patriarchal society, good and honorable traits are expected of men while women are expected to be inferior to men.
However as we’ve realized that women are equal to men and should get equal rights, many men have become whiny bitches who yearn for the so called good old days. Said men don’t seem to realize however that “back when men were men” refers to standards they themselves don’t fulfill. They just want the gender inequality back and that’s it.
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It already is. It’s a wasteland of boomer MAGA bullshit. And they all hate him anyway.
What phase of cesar hair-do is he on? Goldy locks?
When I think of masculine energy I sure as hell don’t think of Marky Z.
That over sized black T and gold chain is so absurd. Maybe I don’t follow enough influencers, but when did alt right culture appropriate last decade’s hip hop style?
He seems like the type that ever since he was a kid would full on cry and make everything miserable for everyone until they just gave him his way to shut him up.
Steering the helm of a massive advertising company that misleads and manipulates users does not seem masculine to me.
Yeah, a tom of Finland character he certainly is not. Like he’s definitely masculine, but more masculine [pejorative] in the vein of a man having a midlife crisis and deciding to get into a sad pantomime of youthful masculinity. He definitely doesn’t seem the type to do hard labor to provide for his loved ones or to spend his evenings in a shed tinkering on his projects. His masculinity is not the presence of the traits our society positively associates with men and masculinity or of those that those who are attracted to masculinity find attractive or endearing, but merely a starker absence of the positive traits associated with femininity or neutrality and an absence of the negative traits of femininity.
Love the Tom of Finland reference I bet it went over most peoples heads
Thanks, I’m a woman who has friends who are leather men so whenever I see these guys going on and on about masculine energy my mind initially goes to leather men. Because the reality is these guys don’t want masculinity for its own sake, that’s leather men, or whatever nick Offerman is doing or wherever else you see people who are masculine because they like it. These men see masculinity as a vehicle for power and staving off their fears of aging. They clearly fear that they’re insufficiently masculine and rather than asking themselves what the root cause of that insecurity is and trying to be the person they genuinely want to be (which may very well mean they take testosterone supplements and get into martial arts) they’re just going to act like a 14 year old who thinks that going full silverback will get him laid, respected, and happiness.
I recently finished the fifth book of the stormlight archive and I really respected the way it dealt with toxic vs healthy masculinity and so that’s actually something that’s just been on my mind a lot lately.
So yeah I guess I’m just not impressed by this performative Rogan style masculinity, if you want to show me how manly you are act like someone with a secure and healthy relationship with his masculinity because as a grown ass adult this Zuckerberg bs is fucking sad
If he isn’t he will after this.
He’s right about one thing: There is a serious lack of actual masculinity among our leaders.
Most public figures who try to present some form of “masculinity” are just desperate and petty, willing to sacrifice nothing to earn their status, and eager to degrade others to look better by comparison.
A real man produces more than he needs, but takes only that much and ensures the rest goes to those who are less able to sustain themselves. They protect the defenseless, elevate those who are ignored, and invest in a future they won’t personally live to enjoy.
Show me a real man among you. It’s not femininity keeping you from finding one. It’s your own greed and hubris.
A real man produces more than he needs, but takes only that much and ensures the rest goes to those who are less able to sustain themselves.
A big part of the issue is men constantly being told that they are responsible for everything. So this attitude would only make the problem worse.
This is why a positive kind of masculinity also needs to reject patriarchy and capitalism.
“Producing more than you take” doesn’t have to mean money. (Though I did mean money in my original comment, cuz Zuck is a greedy monster.)
Just listening to people more than you demand to be listened to. Doing chores that you know your friends and family hate. Sharing your knowledge. Cooking. Fixing things. There are so many ways you can contribute to your group that don’t take money, and don’t even take much time.
Being financially responsible and helping people when you can is important, don’t get me wrong.
But seeing your worth in purely financial terms is really limiting and unhealthy for the individual, and also tends to create perverse hierarchies inside of families.
Right but take what you just said to it’s logical conclusion. Why should only men have those responsibilities? All you’ve really done is create a different, nicer patriarchy, that still expects men to conform to specific gender roles and still expects women to conform to specific gender roles. Consider the inverse, all the people who physically can’t produce more than they require to survive, who need additional attention or care, through no fault of their own. Can those people not be men?
You’ve described just a generally good person, and realistically you’ve described more women than you have men. The goal should be to get rid of the idea that certain responsibilities are reserved for certain genders completely.
Those aren’t unique to men though (except your last paragraph), how is that not general advice?
I think our advice to men should be more:
“Your problems matter”
Or
“Standing on your own two feet (and autonomy) is especially important to most men, so we should change our economy to support that”
I’ve noticed most advice given to men usually boils down to more responsibility or expectation instead of actually giving them something like male specific support programs.
When I was in the military, the best Marines weren’t the ones who could lift the most or run the fastest (though sometimes they did), they were the ones who stayed up late writing up their junior Marines for awards, the ones who skipped their own lunch to teach their squad or platoon how to perform better, and just generally the ones who went out of their own way to improve everyone else’s well-being around them, and all the while keeping their mouth shut up how much they were doing for everyone else.
The whole master-apprentice thing is not really found in America anymore. It is lowkey there in academia, but there is so much admin work that even good PIs struggle. I have not really seen it in my little private industry experience. And I have no public experience to comment.
It does exist in some trades still but that’s also becoming more rare. My father was a farmer and he was always willing to be a mentor to guys he knew who wanted to get into that industry and was willing to help out his neighbor farmers if they needed help. When he died about 10 years ago, all the local farmers came out to help and they helped my family harvest his last crop at no charge to us. Wish that was the way it was in other private sector industries.
This comment makes me want to read “the way of kings” again…
Kaladin is a G. Currently on Oathbringer. I enjoy a good fantasy series, just hate when I run out of books.
Real men are also able to access their emotions, express their needs(both emotional and physical), develop and share empathy, and nurture deep relationships within their community.
Though i would argue none of what either of us said has to do with gender.
Relentlessly locking your own humanity away behind a strong man facade built on shame is one of the biggest reason these fuckers become so hateful and make “manliness” seem like such a putrid prospect.
there’s no such thing as a “real man”… it’s all just roles society has placed upon different genders….
A real man produces more than he needs
And I’m an imaginary man producing just what I need. 👻
The answer is often more complex
The answer is clearly 42i
Either this comment is also misogynistic as all hell, or my mother was very masculine.
Masculinity isn’t just for men. Just like femininity isn’t just for women. A healthy person has a mix of these qualities, along with many others that we don’t tend to align with a specific gender.
When I say “a real man”, I don’t mean it as an objective assessment to stick a person neatly into one of two piles. That’s not how gender works, and it’s not how being a person in general works.
What I mean is that if you’re indulging in behavior like belittling other people for fun or “cool points”, or using your power or physical strength to get what you want, and calling that “being a man”, then your idea of manhood is a mirage. If you want to aspire to something based on your male gender identity, aspire to humility, vigilance, and service to others. Those are great qualities that anyone can have, but they’re especially important for men if we’re gonna have a respectful and productive society.
(Edit: I didn’t downvote you btw. I thought your comment was pretty reasonable and mild. But I did wanna take the opportunity to elaborate, because this topic can be complex and emotionally charged. We all have a lot of baggage when it comes to gender, and it’s hard on the internet to develop rapport with each other.)
It is still misogynistic to say that women who manifest those behaviors are particularly masculine. Those are adult human behaviors.
I don’t know a lot of adult humans who behave that way of either gender.
There is a serious lack actual masculinity among our leaders.
The problem is many people hear these words and instantly jump to toxic masculinity. Which you’re obviously not advocating for, but neither of us are “many people”.
Masculinity has been defined as toxic by default for many.
Yup. It is in most or at least many cases.
I wish I were able to achieve even 0.01% of this, I am just born unable.
It’s ok. It’s going to suck. Real men and women could provide for you. Not that you’re not a real woman/man, but in context.
Thanks, but sadly I think there are no real men/women near me.
