Yes that would probably reflect the opinions some people have here better. Antiwork as a concept never was and never will be about reforming the workplace.
Antiwork as a concept only makes sense in the context of being against the way work is structured under capitalism. The fundamental idea behind work is that certain things need to be done in order for people to live whether people like doing these things or not. We need to produce food, build housing, provide sanitation, healthcare, and all the other things that make a society function. Focusing on labor organization such as forming unions, starting cooperatives, and other ways for workers to take control seems as a more productive way to move forward.
You didn’t address my point. I completely agree with the concept of bullshit jobs, and working towards minimizing required work. However, the concept of work doesn’t go away in any foreseeable future. The real issue is with who decides on the purpose of work and nature of work.
Under capitalism, the means of production are largely owned by a small group of capitalists and the purpose of work is to create further wealth for these people. Any social benefit from work is strictly incidental, and much of this work can even be actively harmful to society. Corporate lobbyists are an example of a job that creates negative social value that would be considered a bullshit job. Furthermore, workplaces are run as dictatorships where the owners get to unilaterally decide how the work is done, and what rights the employees have.
I think that the purpose of work should be to create social value first and foremost. Any required work should be directed towards making life better for everyone. The only way we can achieve that is through public ownership. We need to move away from the capitalist model and move towards socialism where ownership of the means of production is in the hands of the general public. And of course, it should be the workers who make all the decisions regarding how they work.
Simply focusing on antiwork misses the bigger picture and fails to provide emancipation for the people who make our society run.
I didn’t address it because it is not really relevant for Antiwork. I think you need to read up a bit on the theory behind it before jumping to conclusions. Anyways, as I was warned by a moderator here to not get into so many arguments, I will leave it at that.
I’d argue it’s very much relevant to theory behind the whole concept. I’ve read Geaeber, and I’m not jumping to any conclusions here as far as I can tell. Nowhere does Graeber argue that work as a concept would disappear in the foreseeable future. I don’t see Russell arguing anything of the sort either. Since you’re clearly caught up on the theory, why don’t you address the point I made for everyone’s benefit.
While the article by Graeber is mentioned in the reading list, I would personally not associate this article or Graeber’s ideas in general with the Antiwork concept. The idea is much older then Graeber’s writings anyways.
P.S.: Since MLs are often complaining that Anarchists are unwilling to read up on theory, I will leave it as is ;)
To sum up, you provided links to read and now you’re saying you don’t agree with the theory you linked. Amazing stuff. You still haven’t explained how any of the writings contradict my points. The ones I’ve read certainly don’t.
Surely since you’ve read and understood this anarchist theory you’re promoting, you’d be able to explain it to others in simple terms. As Albert Einstein famously said, if you can’t explain it to a six year old, you don’t understand it yourself. I’ll leave it as is. :)
Yes that would probably reflect the opinions some people have here better. Antiwork as a concept never was and never will be about reforming the workplace.
Antiwork as a concept only makes sense in the context of being against the way work is structured under capitalism. The fundamental idea behind work is that certain things need to be done in order for people to live whether people like doing these things or not. We need to produce food, build housing, provide sanitation, healthcare, and all the other things that make a society function. Focusing on labor organization such as forming unions, starting cooperatives, and other ways for workers to take control seems as a more productive way to move forward.
No, that is not what Antiwork is primarily about. Raddle has a nice reading list in case you are interested: https://raddle.me/wiki/antiwork
You didn’t address my point. I completely agree with the concept of bullshit jobs, and working towards minimizing required work. However, the concept of work doesn’t go away in any foreseeable future. The real issue is with who decides on the purpose of work and nature of work.
Under capitalism, the means of production are largely owned by a small group of capitalists and the purpose of work is to create further wealth for these people. Any social benefit from work is strictly incidental, and much of this work can even be actively harmful to society. Corporate lobbyists are an example of a job that creates negative social value that would be considered a bullshit job. Furthermore, workplaces are run as dictatorships where the owners get to unilaterally decide how the work is done, and what rights the employees have.
I think that the purpose of work should be to create social value first and foremost. Any required work should be directed towards making life better for everyone. The only way we can achieve that is through public ownership. We need to move away from the capitalist model and move towards socialism where ownership of the means of production is in the hands of the general public. And of course, it should be the workers who make all the decisions regarding how they work.
Simply focusing on antiwork misses the bigger picture and fails to provide emancipation for the people who make our society run.
I didn’t address it because it is not really relevant for Antiwork. I think you need to read up a bit on the theory behind it before jumping to conclusions. Anyways, as I was warned by a moderator here to not get into so many arguments, I will leave it at that.
I’d argue it’s very much relevant to theory behind the whole concept. I’ve read Geaeber, and I’m not jumping to any conclusions here as far as I can tell. Nowhere does Graeber argue that work as a concept would disappear in the foreseeable future. I don’t see Russell arguing anything of the sort either. Since you’re clearly caught up on the theory, why don’t you address the point I made for everyone’s benefit.
While the article by Graeber is mentioned in the reading list, I would personally not associate this article or Graeber’s ideas in general with the Antiwork concept. The idea is much older then Graeber’s writings anyways.
P.S.: Since MLs are often complaining that Anarchists are unwilling to read up on theory, I will leave it as is ;)
To sum up, you provided links to read and now you’re saying you don’t agree with the theory you linked. Amazing stuff. You still haven’t explained how any of the writings contradict my points. The ones I’ve read certainly don’t.
Surely since you’ve read and understood this anarchist theory you’re promoting, you’d be able to explain it to others in simple terms. As Albert Einstein famously said, if you can’t explain it to a six year old, you don’t understand it yourself. I’ll leave it as is. :)
I didn’t make that list so it is no wonder I don’t agree with the inclusion of every single article.