• FlowVoid@lemmy.world
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      2 months ago

      You should blame the people using those weapons.

      A Swedish made TEC-9 was used to kill Columbine students. That doesn’t make Sweden responsible for the Columbine massacre.

      • archomrade [he/him]
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        2 months ago

        lmao, this would be like if the Columbine shooter had already killed a bunch of kids, and then Sweden handed him a bunch more guns and ammunition and said “but don’t you use it to kill kids, ok?”

      • Soup@lemmy.world
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        2 months ago

        Right but Sweden also didn’t give the Columbine shooter the weapon after they said “I’m gunna kill all these people”. Why do you think those situations are at all close? And do you really think people aren’t blaming Israel?

        • TrickDacy@lemmy.world
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          2 months ago

          do you really think people aren’t blaming Israel?

          OP does, but only secondarily. They always present it like the US is the primary party to blame.

          • archomrade [he/him]
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            2 months ago

            The only reason Israel is able to continue their genocide is the promise of unconditional US support.

                • TrickDacy@lemmy.world
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                  2 months ago

                  No one is “justifying” anything. Bad faith argument

                  An opinion piece and a sketchy blog aren’t really the type of sources I was looking for. To make this bold claim, you’d think you had something like an official in government in either country at least implying its truth

                  People who argue against you don’t have to be rabid genocide lovers. Typically they are just disagreeing with implied conclusions. Such as “the Democrats are the real ones to blame here [so don’t vote for them]”

                  Edit: you totally sidestepped the point I made. Regardless if the US bears some responsibility here, OP constantly says they are primarily responsible, which indicates a specific intention. One that people are upset about. But y’all pretend everyone against that intent supports genocide

                  • archomrade [he/him]
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                    2 months ago

                    No one is “justifying” anything. Bad faith argument

                    Really? I could have sworn I had just read someone downplaying the US’s culpability in the genocide… Maybe I’m projecting someone else’s argument onto you, maybe I should just pose it as a question to get your take:

                    The US is culpable in Israel’s genocide because the US is supplying the weapons being used to slaughter innocent Palestinians, and there is no justification for the US (regardless of administration) continuing to supply arms to Israel while they are actively involved in genocide.

                    Would you agree with that statement? If not, why?

                    People who argue against you don’t have to be rabid genocide lovers. Typically they are just disagreeing with implied conclusions. Such as “the Democrats are the real ones to blame here [so don’t vote for them]”

                    I think I can help clarify this, actually. The explicit conclusion is: “the Democrats share the responsibility for Israel’s genocide because they are materially supporting and enabling its continuation.”

                    There is no conclusion (explicit or implicit) about how this should inform your vote, because -as you’ve alluded- there is no way to vote that does not indirectly enable further genocide. Some people seem more upset about that than others, but that’s not really relevant to the question being asserted.

          • Soup@lemmy.world
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            2 months ago

            Do you know their whole history(you may, I don’t know)? This is just one post and it’s just a link to an article.

            • TrickDacy@lemmy.world
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              2 months ago

              Look at OP’s history. 10 months of posting many times a day, always about this topic, very often laying all the blame on democrats and sometimes advocating for Jill Stein. I’ve called their shit many times, they always deflect.

              Yeah, I know a lot about their history as far as online posters go.

              Edit: don’t bother covering for them. I won’t respond. Just remembered you from before.

              • Keeponstalin@lemmy.world
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                2 months ago

                Their views on voting third party are wrong. But to act like the Democratic administration isn’t the being complicit in by militarily funding an ongoing genocide and has no blame is straight up untrue, at the very least from the perspective of international law. Democratic voters advocating for their administration/ representatives to stop funding a genocide is both moral and democratic

                • TrickDacy@lemmy.world
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                  2 months ago

                  … Ok. Way to pretend to get it but then make up shit I didn’t say to argue against.

                  • Keeponstalin@lemmy.world
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                    2 months ago

                    Maybe I misunderstood.

                    The US is currently sending weapons to Israel, who are actively engaging in genocide. This is illegal by international law, both the the sending of military aid used for genocide and the genocide itself.

                    Under international law, the US is complicit and culpable when it comes to Israel’s genocide, by providing the military weapons for said genocide. Do you disagree?

        • FlowVoid@lemmy.world
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          2 months ago

          Sweden is still selling weapons to Americans. Americans are still using them to shoot each other.

          • archomrade [he/him]
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            2 months ago

            In this comparison, Sweden isn’t “selling” weapons to “Americans”. It’d be more like Sweden was gifting guns directly to the shooter, right after that shooter had already killed a bunch of kids.

            • FlowVoid@lemmy.world
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              2 months ago

              The IDF is not an individual. The US provides arms to Israeli soldiers just as Sweden provides arms to American civilians. The US is not identifying individual soldiers who have killed Palestinians.

              • archomrade [he/him]
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                2 months ago

                Are we suggesting IDF soldiers are unaccountable to the IDF or Israel? Are we suggesting the Israeli genocide is just a bunch of rogue Israeli civilians acting on their own volition?

                What a weird line of defense, comparing war crimes committed by a nation’s military to mass shootings committed by unaffiliated civilian terrorists acting on their own.

                • FlowVoid@lemmy.world
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                  2 months ago

                  I’m suggesting that the one responsible for a killing is the one who pulled the trigger. Or in the case of the military, the one who gave the order.

                  • archomrade [he/him]
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                    2 months ago

                    “the one responsible is […] the one who gave the order”

                    ok so back to your analogy, the US would be handing guns and ammunition the ‘one responsible’, then?